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Metroid Prime Sequence Breaking(v. 5.0) [Previously Ice+Grav before Thardus]

Archived by

Vigama

From: funkytoad | Posted: 2/11/2003 5:36:45 PM
Yes, I'm making this, and Banks gave me the go-ahead, so nyah. I'd say that someone contributes deserves it more than Snoopdigger (whoever that is). So yeah, if someone's mad, take it up with banks, he made me!!1 :O

So yeah, now we've reached a 24% game...woohoo ^_^

www.geocities.com/zellmetroid/

Go there if you'd like to read about all of our strategies (triple bomb jump, skipping various stuff like super missle, charge beam, gravity suit, grappling beam, etc). Also getting a lot of things early, like Plasma beam, Ice beam, Space jump, etc...^_^

Post away =P
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From: funkytoad | Posted: 2/11/2003 5:39:14 PM
Btw, I'm a moron...the real URL to the site is one of these 2:
http://membres.lycos.fr/zell99/metroid
http://membres.lycos.fr/zellmetroid
=D
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From: Banks17 | Posted: 2/11/2003 5:45:26 PM
ok, listen. If you want to make this topic, make sure you're doing it for the right reasons. If i've never seen your name before, and you have not participated in any of the sequence breaking discussions, then you should not be making the next topic.

If you do this, i'm just assuming you're doing this for the newb notoriety in having made a 500 topic post, as these topics seem to go the distance each time they're made. And even if for some reason you feel so inclined to make the next thread in the series, at least use the same name as the previous, with a change in the actual version number. That's what version means. Same thing, just continued/updated.

So with that said, if you have any questions, ideas, or discoveries that have not already been asked or thought up or made in regards to zell's metroid trick web site, please feel free to post them here.

In honor of the 5th series of this topic, i'd like to thank everyone who has participated in these discussions. Kip, Amasawa, DEVILBIT, Zell, Tlj, FunkyToad, Sess, Rage, Solr, Para, Trebon, and to anyone else i may have overlooked. May the discoveries keep coming until we finish the game sans morph ball.
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~Metroid Prime Tricks~
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From: chyse728 | Posted: 2/11/2003 5:59:46 PM
geez, it seems like it was only 2 hrs ago that everyone was saying that 27 was the bottom out point...

i so wish i was following along in my own game with this.
unfortunately, i'm only in the main quarry con grapple on my first try
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From: Mario Cleanstuff | Posted: 2/11/2003 6:03:59 PM
I have one question. What would be the point of skipping the Varia Suit if you have to get energy tanks to do it? Just for the fun of skipping it?

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From: Slortex | Posted: 2/11/2003 6:15:29 PM
I have one question. What would be the point of skipping the Varia Suit if you have to get energy tanks to do it? Just for the fun of skipping it?

trying to get a lower percentage, basically. that, and these people like to cause themselves pain.
From: RockMFR 5 | Posted: 2/11/2003 6:22:06 PM
[This message was deleted at the request of the original poster]
From: Paratroopa1 | Posted: 2/11/2003 6:46:27 PM
Yeah, trying to skip the Varia Suit is only for the fun of it. Even if we make it through Magmoor without Varia (which means we could fight Flaahgra last), we could NOT skip Varia entirely, because we'd still need to get the Artifact of Wild (?). So, we'll have to fight Flaahgra sometime. UNLESS, for some odd reason, it's programmed so that once you get to the point where the Chozo Ghosts are triggered (assuming it's not beating Flaahgra), the game assumes you've beaten Flaahgra already. Which would mean a lot of things:

1) One less room the Spider Ball is required in.
2) Easier to skip the Charge Beam and Super Missiles.

Even if all this worked, it'd be useless anyway, because there's no way we could possibly make it through Magmoor without Varia with less than three E-Tanks. So yeah, it's just for fun. :D

I dunno if we'll ever make it, though. Ah, I'm sure someone will come up with something ingenious sooner or later.
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From: Paratroopa1 | Posted: 2/11/2003 6:51:22 PM
Um, actually, funky toad was quite involved in the last topic.

I'm fairly sure he was talking to the creator of the other IBGSBT (Ice Beam + Gravity Suit before Thardus) 5.0 topic, not funky.
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"I gets soooooooooooooo annoying!" ~ BlueWizard13
"I love to hear people praise me so please feel free to tell me how good I am." ~ jibtothemax
From: HughJass | Posted: 2/11/2003 7:01:37 PM
so did anyone beat that omega pirate or even get to him yet in a 24% game? make sure you get a video!! :)
From: Snoopdigger XP | Posted: 2/11/2003 8:27:44 PM
I had an idea for getting a fourth energy tank, but that idea is down the drain, unless someone comes up with a quadruple bomb jump morph. However, I have the beginnings of a strategy forming. but, halfway through Magmoor Caverns I found it would go a lot easier if I had the space jump boots. So now I am trying to get them before I attempt more runs through Magmoor. I feel this is the only interesting topic to discus since we have already reached rock bottom with 24% game. Can anyone give me tips to get over to that ledge? I tried http://membres.lycos.fr/zell99/metroid/index.html but I still can't get it to work. Anyone?
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I am the Master, version XP.
<|0|> <|0|>
From: keybladeswordsman | Posted: 2/11/2003 8:51:06 PM
Snoopdigger, are you dbjm off the edge of the back of the ship? Are you aiming to the left side of the ledge?( the one that extends a little)If these are not your problems. Just keep practicing until you have you own method of reaching there. Keep trying until you make it.

And were are you coming from in magmoor?

<REPOSTING DATA FROM TALLON OVERWORLD>

Each tank lets you live about 10 seconds.
You can make it to the moniter station in about 40 seconds.
Speeding through as fast as you can without getting too much damage will get better results.
Magmoors usually give 20 health.(not sure of it is worth it)
Don't use missiles so you can get health instead(uncomfirmed that it is worth it)
The moniter station to the elevator can be done under 40 seconds if you can avoid turrets and puffers.( to get the energy tank in tunnel is 8 more seconds)

So, unless you can refill all your health to max in the room before the montiter station, you can make it. Unless you have 8 tanks.

Currently there is no way of doing this yet.

SUMMARY

0_0 ( before entering)
!_! ( in magmoor)
>_< ( in room where you see fire and triclops)
X_X ( at room before moniter station)
From: SuperSayian | Posted: 2/11/2003 8:54:33 PM
Dang... l2ag3 finished off V4.0 I almost had it!

On a side note what is going to get broken now? How about a count of how many missles / bombs, everythign that can get gotten before the rock guy? (sorry sp)

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From: l2ag3 | Posted: 2/11/2003 8:55:38 PM
muahahahaha :)
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From: Amasawa | Posted: 2/11/2003 8:59:51 PM
snoopdigger, which e-tank were you thinking about? I'm pretty sure they've all been accounted for as to which ones you can/can't get before heading into magmoor because of stuff that's clearly not passable, like wave beam doors, etc.; am I overlooking one?

speaking of which, a list of e-tanks and why each one can/can't be picked up without getting varia first might be useful...

---
Metroid Prime Discoveries
http://membres.lycos.fr/zell99/metroid
From: keybladeswordsman | Posted: 2/11/2003 9:00:02 PM
What other rooms do you need the spider ball in?

If i could find a way to get past mogmoor w/o varia yo trigger those ghosts somehow without the varia, that would drop it to a 23%( 22% if I could some how skip spider ball and I know killing flaahgra is needed for the artifact)
From: Snoopdigger XP | Posted: 2/11/2003 9:03:15 PM
I have an idea of speed shooting enemies in the Lava Lake. It is hard, but doable. You have to keep moving and keep shooting. If this works out, you will gain energy at a 78% rate. You can up this if all three crate at the end of Lava Lake are small energies. Oh yeah, I had trouble getting through Lava Lake with that strategy, because I kept falling in Lava. So now I am after the space jump boots. As I said before, any tips?
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I am the Master, version XP.
<|0|> <|0|>
From: Arathorn21st | Posted: 2/11/2003 9:03:22 PM
I posted this earlier in topic 4.
Probably minor but could the Plasma Beam take the place of the Pulse Beam to destroy the rock? It would be one step closer to no Boost Ball...
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From: Amasawa | Posted: 2/11/2003 9:03:40 PM
metroid quarantine a for spider ball. besides that and the sun tower I think that's it. Everything else has a workaround IIRC.
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From: Amasawa | Posted: 2/11/2003 9:06:34 PM
don't know about that myself Arathorn. you can skip that part if you get an early pbomb expansion, but of course that's an extra item so far, so it would be worth checking. geo core and life grove are still two biggest problems blocking any possible way of finishing the game with no boost ball at all, though.
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From: Admiral Aken Bosch | Posted: 2/11/2003 9:08:46 PM
Someone has managed to get to the Phendrana Drifts WITHOUT the Varia Suit (with only 12 or so energy), but was killed by the Coldness in Phendrana, meaning it is impossible to skip the Varia Suit.

I'll try to dig up the topic this was mentioned in and post the URL
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From: l2ag3 | Posted: 2/11/2003 9:54:43 PM
why would the programers waste extra time and memory making phendrana hurt you if your not supposed to get there untill you have the varia suit?
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"He stole our backup plan for just incase!" - Ben from Brave fencer musashi
From: Nebulus F90 | Posted: 2/11/2003 9:58:53 PM
perhaps to make smartalecs like us feel dumb?

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From: Paratroopa1 | Posted: 2/11/2003 10:15:42 PM
Did someone mention the Pulse Beam? I just figured out how to do it without Boost Ball.

It's very, very simple, really. Just roll into it quickly, bomb out of it, lather, rinse, repeat. Do it until the pulse beam points at the wall, then scan the computer and voila! Elite Research -> Research Access w/o Boost Ball.

I don't remember who came up with that trick, I didn't originally think of it. I think I'm the first one to apply it to something, though.

Unfortunately, this trick does not work with most spinners because the platforms they raise or the doors start to close or fall if not activated quickly. And even if they didn't, Life Grove Tunnel still looks bleak w/o Boost Ball.

Well, there you go. Don't have to worry about the Pulse Beam anymore. :)
---
"I gets soooooooooooooo annoying!" ~ BlueWizard13
"I love to hear people praise me so please feel free to tell me how good I am." ~ jibtothemax
From: Banks17 | Posted: 2/11/2003 10:20:46 PM
by smartalecs you mean elite metroid prime masters? =p

Admiral Aken Bosch:

I remember the post you're talking about, and we later proved that guy to be lying. He said "his friend" was giving him all the information and it turned out "his friend" was pulling his leg. No one has made it so far as Phendrana drifts without the varia suit so instant-freeze upon entering it has not been confirmed.

If there is a gameshark or something for the gamecube someone could test it by using an infinite energy code. But until that happens or someone actually makes it there, we still won't know for sure.
---
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From: Grinto | Posted: 2/11/2003 11:51:11 PM
As for the energy tanks, Phendrana has three, and the Phazon Mines has two... can't even make it there yet.
Can't enter the freight without ice beam, there's two there...

The two in Magmoor can't be gotten, they're too far away and I think you can only reach one from Phendrana (Magmoor Workstation)...

Which leaves us with the five in Chozo Ruins. Three can be gotten, but we need the Ice Beam to get the Hall of Elders one, because of the slot in the wall, and I believe Training Chamber was inaccessible due to a blocked Morph Ball tunnel...

That's all of 'em...
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From: Amasawa | Posted: 2/12/2003 12:00:50 AM
thx Grinto, that's helpful to see everything listed like that. so Snoopdigger, unless you've got some astounding trick to take care of any of these, 3's the limit until you're almost thru magmoor, and at that point it'd be safer to go for the elevator anyway so you can recharge at the save station, then come back to get it later. Good luck with the run; I hope someone can make it somehow.
---
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From: Youkai Sesshoumaru | Posted: 2/12/2003 5:11:02 AM
YOOOOO dudes

I'm doing a 24 percent run also (on normal) and I've gotten to the frigate. No point putting it off now, I have to screw around with hydro access tunnel or stop where I am

So ANYWay, I found a very promising (to me at least) way of getting through Hydro Access with NO DANGER of hitting the e-tank and thusly having to start over.

_______|'''''|
______ S''''|
''''''''''''''''|''''''''|

This is a horrible depiction of a part of Hydro Access Tunnel.

ABOVE the S is the energy tank, you don't want to go that way, because if you touch it you must start over (if indeed you are doing a low percent run)

BELOW the S is where you want to go, but a current is going against you

HOWEVER, at this point in the tunnel...

The TOP overlaps the bottom a bit, as the picture shows

Putting Samus AT the S gives her a clear path DOWNWARD

But she is in no danger from going UP thanks to the celing.

Okay, now as for how to prevent her from boosting right

The Z axis is the axis which is neither up nor to the side. It is the depth axis, the one that goes INTO your television.

That dimension is of concern to me, for this reason

There is ROOM in that dimension in the tunnel. Slight, oh so slight, but there is ROOM

If you push UP on the control stick and DOWN on the control stick, samus will wiggle in this dimension. If you move samus RIGHT AGAINST the TV screen, and then push UP and move her AWAY from it, and RELEASE your boost as you do this

Samus will boost away, in the z dimension
and continue this boost DOWN along the wall which she hits

Most of the time this boost is a very small move down

However, by doing this a lot, I have gotten by accident some of the boosts to be the GREAT BIG kind that sends you way down

If you stay IN THIS SPOT waiting for THAT to happen, you are in NO DANGER of going up to the e-tank

And thusly, in no danger of having to restart

as long as you don't push RIGHT, she won't go right, assuming you've pointed her in the Z dimension by pushing up and down

okay then, I still haven't gotten to the OTHER side with this, but it looks promising to me ;)

---
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From: Youkai Sesshoumaru | Posted: 2/12/2003 5:13:06 AM
P.S. Okay, not NO danger, you still might fall UP where the tank is due to having to balance so delicately on the corner as you do

BUT, if you do go up where the tank is the same thing applies

If you use UP and DOWN to point Samus along the Z axis, your boosts should never go to the left if you don't PUSH left (or right) and thusly never into the tank.

---
Santa Claus: "Your fondness of cheese won't help you now, evil wizard!"
Daolon Wong: "That's CHI not CHEESE!" -- Jackie Chan Adventures
From: Youkai Sesshoumaru | Posted: 2/12/2003 5:28:57 AM
Update on all that: I got out of the tunnel. My 24 game can continue. At... THE MINES *shudder*

Here's PRECICELY what happened that I got out so you all may try to repeat it, or have it be repeated on you by whatever divine entity allowed it to happen to me.

I was up by the e-tank

I didn't touch it due to what I'd said. All I ever hit was up and down so I never went to the side

I held up to push her away from the screen as I charged my boost

I pushed down and released my boost a split second after doing that

I KEPT HOLDING DOWN

She went down just a small ways, but she stuck and stayed pointed down

I had time to charge up my boost and send her down more

as long as I KEPT HOLDING DOWN, she kept that direction, and she didn't move up :P

I boosted all the way to the bottom and out.

Better hurry Amasawa, I'm gonna beat you ;)

---
Santa Claus: "Your fondness of cheese won't help you now, evil wizard!"
Daolon Wong: "That's CHI not CHEESE!" -- Jackie Chan Adventures
From: Grinto | Posted: 2/12/2003 7:38:21 AM
So, this is a race all of a sudden...?
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Roboticus is Champion!
From: Blackbelt Bobman | Posted: 2/12/2003 7:41:33 AM
I skipped the thermal visor, and I'll be damned if it didn't cut about an hour off of my time. If you get it once you have the phazon suit, you can just go through the ice beam door and grab the items and artifact that are in the area behind it. VERY useful.
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From: Youkai Sesshoumaru | Posted: 2/12/2003 8:08:52 AM
Yes Grinto, it is a race. Nothing matters but who gets there first. Because everything I say is absolutely serious and must be taken literally and interpreted in the worst possible way and never to be taken in a joking manner.
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Santa Claus: "Your fondness of cheese won't help you now, evil wizard!"
Daolon Wong: "That's CHI not CHEESE!" -- Jackie Chan Adventures
From: The Idiotic Police | Posted: 2/12/2003 8:29:49 AM
Grinto, you are under arrest
From: tlj9204 | Posted: 2/12/2003 8:36:52 AM
Amasawa - I would indeed appreciate tips on the Beam Troopers w/o the Charge Beam ^_^

-Tim
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From: HughJass | Posted: 2/12/2003 8:48:22 AM
I can't believe you guys got through the Crashed Frigate without the Gravity Suit. That's pure insanity. I spent about half hour tryin to get the Chozo Artifact in Wavebuster area without the Gravity Suit before giving up in utter frustration. Anyone got any tricks for this?
From: Snoopdigger XP | Posted: 2/12/2003 8:49:23 AM
Keep shooting at them. You have to never stay in one place for more than 1/4 of a second. Keep locked onto one of the beam troopers, and jump and rotate in crazy directions. Chances are they won't hit you, just don't go back to where you where before until at least 7 seconds have passed. Keep firing.
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<|0|> <|0|>
From: Grinto | Posted: 2/12/2003 9:41:47 AM
I just asked a simple question, and now I'm under arrest?!?!

Heh... I don't know what to say...

*calls lawyers*
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Roboticus is Champion!
From: Auron03 | Posted: 2/12/2003 9:47:12 AM
someone wanna help me get to the reflecting pool without spider ball?
im in the hall of elders now
and i have an idea how to get to the hole where you need to bomb to open the beam hole things but its not working

HELP!!
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From: zell99 | Posted: 2/12/2003 10:52:16 AM
auron- if you want to go through hall of elders without spider ball, just activate the slot high on the wall by space jumping on the piece that sticks out of that big solar-pannel kind of thing. once you stand on it, just jump on the ledge above and activate the slot, which will open the 3 other ball slots (wave, ice, plasma) shoot the wave one, and get in the statue's hands. it'll shoot you up there
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From: Auron03 | Posted: 2/12/2003 11:13:20 AM
yeah i was trying to get up before then got so frustrated cuz she wouldnt make it so then i posted and then tried again and made it so
now i have the ice beam!! whoo
again!
lol
thanks anyways
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From: Sir Teddious | Posted: 2/12/2003 11:45:36 AM
How can u skip the super missle? Don't u need it to get into certain rooms and reveal power conduits?
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From: Amasawa | Posted: 2/12/2003 12:54:36 PM
Couple quick things:

Sesshoumaru's explanation of boosting through hydro access is dead-nuts on. I never thought about it in terms of the z-axis like he's talking about, but otherwise what he explained is extremely close to the same way I managed my way through there (couldn't continue boosting once I came to a complete stop; that's the only difference). Holding up, then pushing down and releasing boost is key, apparently. I wasn't sure exactly why that seemed to work for me, but with another confirmation that makes much more sense. Bravo Sesshoumaru!

Tim, for the power pirates in ore processing, roll past 'em and quickly activate the spider column so you can roll up the blue track to the next level. You can kinda use the floor as cover to pick 'em off from there, at least until you get rid of one. After that taking out the other pirate is a matter of keeping your distance and dodging as usual. Make sure you've filled up your energy before heading into this room; use the game's systems of reloading rooms to gather energy pickups from easy enemies. I'll try to post more info later if you still need it.

Teddious, read the topic and visit the site. If you can't reach either of them, please let zell know so that he's aware of what's going on with traffic. thanks.
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From: DEVILBIT | Posted: 2/12/2003 1:12:02 PM
Hi.

Impresive. Great amount of dedication with people like this cant see how this game could be in better hands.

Somethings to try out when bored, just for the sake of grabing out of order.

Grab the main plaza energy tank by space jumping from the right side elevation.

Also the furnance missile expansion can be grabbed without bombing the floor. At the back of the generator (facing from the ice door) theres a hole in the wall were you can latch. From there jump tp the magnetic rail above, on the second jump press sideways, shell clinch there. From there jump to the rail at samus back. From there to the tubes on the front. Once up there is possible to grab the missile exp., if you dont have spider its trickier cause it needs a very well placed bomb jump.

Its interesting that samus can clinge to that magnetic rail, wich has a similar positioning to the one in quarentine A. Probably its been tryed a lot in quarentine A, but seen how similar this one is maybe theres hope for that room.
From: bluefish | Posted: 2/12/2003 4:51:30 PM
I just tried to get the plasma beam early but fell. Unfortunately I saved my game too, thinking the room would reset. But it didn't. Now the jump from the spire appears too large. Did I mess it up this go around?
From: l2ag3 | Posted: 2/12/2003 5:08:19 PM
you have to do an l-lock spring jump (something like that) goto zells site to find out how to.
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From: Banks17 | Posted: 2/12/2003 6:08:01 PM
Devilbit: you can get that energy tank by going through the small hole in the room behind where you fight hive mecha. It leads to the vault / that etank

and Rage: you don't have to spring jump on that particular jump (from the spike to the platform). A normal, well timed space jump should be good enough.
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From: Amasawa | Posted: 2/12/2003 6:15:52 PM
I confirm Youkai Sesshoumaru's trick to climb the suntower w/o super missiles. The trickiest part of it for me was just getting bombs 2 & 3 placed consistently well. After that it was a matter of time getting the rest of them to come together. Pretty tough trick if you ask me. Once again, congrats on the discovery, Sesshoumaru!
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From: Banks17 | Posted: 2/12/2003 6:19:11 PM
Devilbit: i think you should get working on metroid quarantine A so i can get phazon suit> thardus ;)
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From: Hairy Tongue | Posted: 2/12/2003 6:21:28 PM
Don't you need the super missle to blow up the Cordite thing in front of the power conduit to Thardus?
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From: Banks17 | Posted: 2/12/2003 6:23:41 PM
Hairy Tongue: By using the method of getting the ice beam early, you can skip past the area behind the thermal visor, and go into thardus's lair the back way. Even picking up plasma beam right before the fight =p
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From: CyberGlitch | Posted: 2/12/2003 7:08:52 PM
I know I haven't posted on any of your topics, but I am very interested in all glitches, and the way you guys have figured out how to skip things in the game amazes me...but I can't see any of the movies on the website (http://membres.lycos.fr/zell99/metroid) because it returns an error message...it says I don't have the proper decompressing software or something....any help? Do you know where I could get that software?
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From: Amasawa | Posted: 2/12/2003 7:26:58 PM
donwload divx if you don't have it already; that's what I needed to do, at least.
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From: Amasawa | Posted: 2/12/2003 7:28:06 PM
sorry, should have mentioned that he's got links to that and Media Player on the front page, I think, somewhere in one of the old updates messages.
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From: Amasawa | Posted: 2/12/2003 7:29:03 PM
make that the VIDEOS page. Wow am I even more out of it than usual today. =)
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Metroid Prime Discoveries
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From: Youkai Sesshoumaru | Posted: 2/12/2003 7:30:55 PM
Glad you made it up Amasawa. Looks like you'll be the one to absolutely confirm the do-ability of 24% after all :P I for one am glad since you were the one to confirm 28% back when that happened. Like a mini-tradition I suppose

Be sure to tell us how you fare with OP. I'll get to him as soon as I get through the AAAAAAH HORRIBLE mines

The troopers... the TROOPERS... Can't... get... THROUGH...

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From: Amasawa | Posted: 2/12/2003 7:41:03 PM
Yeah, I'd like to be able to finish a 24% run, but OP's cronies are giving me all kinds of trouble w/o charge beam. =( During one battle I was lucky enough to get 5 plasma troopers and one ice at the end (2 waves of 3 troopers), but guess which one shot me in the back just before OP was about to appear for the last time? -_-
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From: AncientMagus | Posted: 2/12/2003 8:03:47 PM
Dang, I could've helped with some of these, but the first time I noticed what people were doing was about the time you guys started trying to get down the Hydro Access Tunnel without Gravity. Good job on that, by the way.
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From: Youkai Sesshoumaru | Posted: 2/12/2003 9:13:33 PM
I'd like to make an announcement

The wave troopers are handing my ass to me.

Repeatedly.

They are coming up to me and saying "here this is for you"

And then they give me a present

I open the present and inside is... MY ASS

And it's so weird it's like "How did my ass get into that package without my knowing?"

And they're like "Well we were kicking it around like a soccer ball earlier, and thought you might want it back"

So I'm like "Coool, thanks wave troopers"

Stupid mines. I'm going to be sooo good at dodging when I finally get through that Ridley and Prime will be nothing.

---
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Daolon Wong: "That's CHI not CHEESE!" -- Jackie Chan Adventures
From: Youkai Sesshoumaru | Posted: 2/12/2003 9:15:35 PM
Know what else they're doing?

Owning me

They're going to the store and buying me

WHOLESALE

and they're using credit. I was hoping their card would be denied but no, they bought me and took me home and gave me to their dog as a chew toy.
---
Santa Claus: "Your fondness of cheese won't help you now, evil wizard!"
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From: funkytoad | Posted: 2/12/2003 9:20:32 PM
MAYBE YOU SHOULD STOP SUCKING THEN! Mwahaha etc.
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From: Swimmerboy | Posted: 2/12/2003 9:37:15 PM
i find it amazing that just a few weeks ago the limit was a 27% game!
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From: Amasawa | Posted: 2/12/2003 9:39:07 PM
So basically, they're owning you, but they're giving your ass to you to play with. XD

Don't feel bad. Omega Pirate is actually tearing my ass into tiny little pieces and handing it out to his beam trooper posse as hors d'oervres. Naturally, they're pretty pissed off that they've been given appetizers to eat that taste like my ass, so they're coming after me to pay me back a hundred fold. For having to eat my ass. And one of them is holding a spoon. :-O
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From: Grinto | Posted: 2/12/2003 10:16:13 PM
Heh heh heh, you guys are having WAY too much fun here...

Though is probably is helping you get through these frustrating parts...
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From: Gold Leader | Posted: 2/13/2003 7:40:02 AM
I need help in getting the plasma beam early. I can Activate the spiner things and the spider ball track and can jump on the thin railing that goes around the room, but I can't jump on the first spider ball thing that has the light thing on it. Can you guys Help?
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From: Snoopdigger XP | Posted: 2/13/2003 9:06:06 AM
Help help help help *takes breath* HELP!

I think I am doing something wrong while I am trying to get the Space Jump Boots early. I tried the dbjm from the rock, but that is not getting me anywhere. So I am stuck with the back-of-the-ship-bomb-ladder-technique. I am having two problems. I will try to demonstrate what is happening to me.

== means something solid that you have to land/take off from.
X = Bomb
+ = Samus and a bomb.
---\__/--- = Samus's trajectory

== ____ X
/ \+
/ =============

Trial 1: I don't hit bomb 2 and I fall short

/\
== / \-+
/
/ =============

Trail 2: I hit the second bomb and don't get enough height.

Can anyone help?!

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From: zell99 | Posted: 2/13/2003 10:12:21 AM
snoop- first of all, your ascii drawings are awful >>XD
did you check the video on my website? you'll realise the ladder bomb jump is not necessary. do a normal dbj from the very tip of the left turbine (samus should be in mid-air over the fire that comes out of the turbine). the trick is to place bomb 3 BEFORE your peak, and just before bomb 2 explodes, press and hold forward, you'll have more forward movement when bomb 3 hits you (it is supposed to hit you since you placed it lower) and morph out. when i made it up the ledge, i had the animation where samus stands up and do some kind of front-flip, not the running animation.

hope this helps. ;)
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From: Amasawa | Posted: 2/13/2003 10:34:23 AM
gold leader -- if you're coming close to the height of the post sticking out of the middle of the spider ball block, you're probably on the right track. afaik you can't land on the post itself, but you can push against its slanted surfaces as you jump to give you more height.

if that doesn't help, could you explain what it looks like on your best attempt to make the jump? (to give me an idea of what must be corrected in order to get the trick to work for you) thx.
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From: tlj9204 | Posted: 2/13/2003 2:58:07 PM
...Could this thread actually be dying in its fifth form? I remember being able to leave for an hour and see 50+ new replies...

That said, *BUMP*!

-Tim
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From: kip | Posted: 2/13/2003 3:30:35 PM
i don't know, i don't think there's much left to break. we've said this before though...

i don't have any new ideas right now. the rooms i haven't figured out before, i still can't (quarantine A, sun tower without spider ball, various rooms without boost ball just for the hell of it, etc).
From: Gold Leader | Posted: 2/13/2003 4:25:21 PM
On my best attempt I can look as far down as I can, (I am looking on the right side of it , the side under the other one of the spider ball brock) And the light is almost the middle.
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From: HughJass | Posted: 2/13/2003 4:45:03 PM
No one ever answered my post about Chozo Artifact in wavebuster room without Gravity suit...
From: Amasawa | Posted: 2/13/2003 4:46:05 PM
okay, try this: (sorry if any of this reiterates the site; I'm just going off the top of my noggin here)

Stand to the right of the spider ball block (so that if you jumped straight up you wouldn't hit it). Look down maybe halfway as far as you can or a little less, and also look very slightly to the right, AWAY from the block. Lock position with the L trigger.

On the first jump, push against the wall (you should be pushing against rock wall that slopes upward) for about the first half of the jump, then pull away from the wall and to the left, out in front of the spider block. On the second jump, pull back further if you still need a little more room to clear the block, then push forward against the top of the post sticking out of the middle of the block, favoring the right side of it a little so that if you miss, you'll fall forward and to the right back onto the ledge.

Once you make it onto the spider block, make sure you move away from the wall a little before you jump to the ice door, or you'll hit your head on part of the wall that sticks out above and it may be enough to make you fall off.
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From: Amasawa | Posted: 2/13/2003 4:49:30 PM
Hugh (I refuse to type your entire handle =]), push against the wall in front of you on your first jump, then pull away as you start your second jump and push forward again about midway through it. You can use walls/surfaces underwater this way to get incredible height w/o grav.
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From: Gold Leader | Posted: 2/13/2003 5:15:21 PM
Amasawa, THANKSSSSSS!!!!!!!! I just got it. now I can get the ice spreader before Thardus!!!!! Thanks thanks thanks
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From: Gold Leader | Posted: 2/13/2003 7:29:19 PM
BBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBB
UUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU
MMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM
PPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPP
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From: Snoopdigger XP | Posted: 2/13/2003 7:35:33 PM
Zell99, thanks for the tip. I know my ASCII drawings suck, I ran out of room for the high-quality drawings so I had yo settle for the stupid ones. I have checked out your website, and I think it's a great idea. As for downloading the vids, My computer keeps crashing when I try to download the correct software in order to view them. Then again, I' on vacation in Mammoth Mountain, so maybe this computer can handle it...

Anyway thanks a lot. As soon as I get the Space Jump Boots I will go for the Varia-less Magmoor run. I will be sure to get a video for you as soon as I make it.
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From: Amasawa | Posted: 2/13/2003 7:35:40 PM
glad to help. ^_^ now go kick Thardus's rocky butt, if you haven't had a chance to do it yet.
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From: Banks17 | Posted: 2/13/2003 7:45:00 PM
BoU_MoP
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From: Mario Cleanstuff | Posted: 2/13/2003 8:00:40 PM
If you are sensitive to bragging people, please do not read this.

As holder of the fastest frigate escape time, I think I can try the Magmoor run on Monday. I'm grounded, but I don't have school and my parents have work then. Might have to push it to Tues... Don't know.

---
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From: Snoopdigger XP | Posted: 2/13/2003 8:25:10 PM
Lucky. I am away at the mountains snowboarding, so I won't be blew to go through a run in Magmoor until Sat.
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<|0|> <|0|>
From: keybladeswordsman | Posted: 2/13/2003 8:53:34 PM
<REPOSTING DATA>
Speeding through as fast as you can without getting too much damage will get better results.
Magmoors usually give 20 health.(not sure of it is worth it)
Don't use missiles so you can get health instead(uncomfirmed that it is worth it)
The moniter station to the elevator can be done under 40 seconds if you can avoid turrets and puffers.( to get the energy tank in tunnel is 8 more seconds)

So, unless you can refill all your health to max in the room before the montiter station, you can make it. Unless you have 8 tanks.

life span, 40 seconds. Needed lifespan, 80 sec.

(Do you guys keep ignoring me?)
From: RockMFR 5 | Posted: 2/13/2003 9:41:59 PM
So, amawasa is at OP? Geez, you guys are almost to 24%. It will make the hours in the sun tower all worth while :)

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From: Amasawa | Posted: 2/13/2003 9:50:22 PM
I finished it today, so I confirm a 24% run.
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From: zell99 | Posted: 2/13/2003 9:53:17 PM
rock: no.. amasawa completed his 24% normal run in 5:47 i think. WOOHOO AMA =D
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From: Paratroopa1 | Posted: 2/13/2003 9:56:40 PM
I just discovered something recently.

RUINED COURTYARD W/O BOOST BALL!!!

Yes, this is nearly completely useless since you can just completely skip the Ruined Courtyard anyway, but I'm just trying to cover everything, okay? >=P

First of all, kill the damn Flickerbats (or Flying Pirates if you're that far in the game) in the room. I nearly fell off after some Flickerbats hit me. >:o

The only thing you'll need is the Space Jump.

Now, this kind of spawns a new manuever, but it's really just a spin-off of L-Lock Spring Jump.

Go to the spinner at the bottom of the room nearest to the Save Room behind the Missile door. Instead of using the spinner (which you can't do :P), jump on top of the weird lever thing at the top of it. Now, LOCK YOUR VIEW FORWARD, for some reason this seems to make you jump slightly farther and higher, I could not do it without locking my view forward. Now, do one jump slightly backwards, and at the apex of the jump, do a second jump and push forward to get onto the platform. Now do a fairly easy LLSJ from that platform to the platform directly ahead of it. From there, it's simple, just jump up the platforms like normal.
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From: HughJass | Posted: 2/13/2003 9:56:58 PM
Hey Amasawa, your name has a lot of A's! Any vids of those l33t skillz kickin the crap outta OP or ridley or MP?
From: Amasawa | Posted: 2/13/2003 10:07:29 PM
nah, I didn't bother cuz all I have to do that with's a digital camera. I can take some short ones if you REALLY wanna see 'em, but the quality's crap and I understand kip's working on some really nice looking videos of that kind of thing (and on Hard mode, what's more o_O)
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From: kip | Posted: 2/14/2003 5:58:58 AM
"As holder of the fastest frigate escape time, I think I can try the Magmoor run on Monday."

go for it then, mario. good luck. =P
From: tlj9204 | Posted: 2/14/2003 9:36:41 AM
What is the fastest time, btw? Banks and I were having a discussion last night about my getting 7 minutes.

-Tim
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From: Jial Silverthorn | Posted: 2/14/2003 10:54:12 AM
Well, I am not good enough to actually do HALF of this stuff *HACKTBJHACK*, but it has made my life easier. Plasma Beam + Flamethrower = Crispy Fried Rocks (Thardus). If somehow a Varia-less Magmoor run is done, I will be very amazed. I can get within eyesight of Monitor station, and then I die... :(

Keep the good work coming guys. Me, I have to go have a discussion with my tbj skills.
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From: zell99 | Posted: 2/14/2003 11:03:11 AM
tlj- Mario means the escape the frigate time (the best time REMAINING on the counter)... it is 4:07.26
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From: tlj9204 | Posted: 2/14/2003 11:23:28 AM
Oh then. Damn, that's pretty good. I can't do it over 4 minutes :P Thanks zell.

-Tim
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From: Paratroopa1 | Posted: 2/14/2003 4:33:56 PM
Page 2? :(

*kicks topic back up to page 1*

LIVE, DAMNIT!!!

If someone's around Ruined Courtyard sometime and hasn't used the Spinners, would they ocnfirm my method for me (even though I know it works)? :(
---
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From: kip | Posted: 2/14/2003 4:37:19 PM
"I can get within eyesight of Monitor station, and then I die... :("

haha, join the club. =P
From: Mario Cleanstuff | Posted: 2/14/2003 6:06:26 PM
Metroid Prime Sequence Bumping(v. 5.0) [Previosly Ice+Grav before Thardus]

---
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Whoosh. 'Splode. Sploosh. Squat. CALL ME STUPID!!!
From: annoynweirdklown | Posted: 2/14/2003 6:10:12 PM
any luck on the vairaless run. i want to see samus freeze in phenendra
From: cheaterfreak | Posted: 2/14/2003 6:34:03 PM
mind telling me how to do the triple bomb jump the address didn't work no matter what
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From: MIKINATOR | Posted: 2/14/2003 6:41:15 PM
WOW. All I have to say is WOW... How i nthe Hell do you beat the game with out the:
Super Missiles
· Thermal Visor
· Grapple Beam
· Gravity Suit
??????????????????? Damn! Or getting the:
· Ice Beam
· Gravity Suit
· Plasma Beam
· Wavebuster
· Ice Spreader
· Flamethrower
· X-Ray Visor
before even battling Thardus?!?! Congrats. Thats amazing...
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From: Suikunrules | Posted: 2/14/2003 6:50:13 PM
I think all this skipping has screwed my file!

I deleted my Normal 27% (which I completed the DAY BEFORE 25% was achieved XD) for a Hard file. My goal was to skip the crap out of everything. Ice and Plasma Beams before Thardus, every beam combo, X-Ray Visor, the works.

I gave up on Space Jump before Flaahgra and Lifegiver before Grav Suit, but everything else went according to plan. After the Grav Suit, I headed to the Research Core and grabbed the Thermal Visor from the back. As I was heading to the X-Ray Visor, I realized I had forgotten the Super Missile. I took the long way around to avoid Thardus and got to the Observatory.

That was ten minutes ago.

I sincerely hope that I am missing something, because I think the game may be impossible to complete.

In the Observatory, you know how you have to activate the map hologram before you can reach the Super Missile upgrade? I can't do it. I seem to remember scanning a post on the far side of the room in earlier files, but there's nothing. I have scanned every friggin' thing in the room that I can see, and the Spinners aren't functioning.

The Super Missile seems to be out of reach.

Worse, I can't get past the Observatory. Since you can't get past Research Lab Aether from the back (since the Pirate won't break the glass when the Metroid dies), the Control Tower is impossible to get to. That's where the Artifact of Elder is, making the game, I think, impossible.

Please tell me I'm being a flaming idiot and I've missed something painfully obvious and I should be tarred and feathered. I really don't want to start over...

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Blah.
From: cheaterfreak | Posted: 2/14/2003 7:04:54 PM
HHEEELLLPPPP please HHHEELLPP
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From: zell99 | Posted: 2/14/2003 7:07:53 PM
sink- you have to scan the computer on the ground level of the observatory. that will activate a morph ball slot on the wall, jump in it and bomb it. that will activate yet another morph ball slot a little higher, get there and bomb it. that will activate the 4 spinners on the ground, get in and boost them...

and you have to kill every enemies in the room before you can scan the computer on the ground..
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From: zell99 | Posted: 2/14/2003 7:12:51 PM
cheaterfreak- go to one of the addresses in my sig, it's well explained in there... if it doesnt work, i'll explain very briefly here..

bomb 1- whenever you want
bomb 2- as soon as you land from bomb 1's explosion
bomb 3- just before bomb 2 propels you
bomb 4- at the peak of your jump (from bomb 2)
bomb 5- in the air after bomb 3 propels you but before bomb 4 hits you
bomb 6- a little before the peak of the jump from bomb 4
you should fall after placing bomb 6, get hit by bomb 5 back up into bomb 6 giving you more height. the timing of 5-6 is tricky, play with it and have fun ;)
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From: Phediuk | Posted: 2/14/2003 7:12:52 PM
QUESTION!

With all this skipping, you don't need to go anywhere near the Research Facility in Phendrana.

In the courtyard and the Observatory, there are Spinner devices, which you need the Boost Ball for. Luckily, you don't have to use them.

The only other places I can think of that seemingly require the Boost Ball are raising the bridge to the Warrior Shrine, and getting to the Plasma Beam.

With these facts in hand, is it possible to accomplish either of those tasks without the Boost Ball?
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From: zell99 | Posted: 2/14/2003 7:15:14 PM
you can get to the Warrior shrine without boosting the bridge, just stand on a computer and l-lock spring jump to the ledge.

up to now, you need boost ball for geothermal core (plasma beam) and life grove (to get the artifact). also in hydro access tunnel in the crashed frigate, the boost ball is needed to get through the current pushing you up when you don't have the gravity suit.
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From: Paratroopa1 | Posted: 2/14/2003 8:11:45 PM
Don't fotget Life Grove Tunnel. I've looked at that room for a while, and I'd really like to see someone get past that without Boost Ball. As I've stated before, I've come close, but it's just not happening. Not to mention that you need to go back through it without Boost Ball as well.

Well anyway, today I'm definately going to take a look at Geothermal Core and see what can be done there without Boost Ball & Grapple Beam, if anything. It can't hurt.

If I do, then I will do my best to get a screenshot of me with the Plasma Beam and facing the Boost Ball powerup before AR comes out. :P

I think I'm going to also confirm or not confirm the whole "L-Locking your view makes you jump higher" thing by doing Ruined Courtyard w/o Boost Ball again (I still haven't used the Spinners) and see if I can do it without L-Locking my view. Maybe L-Locking my view simply helped me stay looking forward so I didn't lose altitude.
---
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From: Amasawa | Posted: 2/14/2003 8:22:20 PM
Useless info: It's possible to get through the underwater frigate w/o grav or the space jump. Problem is, I don't think I can get back out. <=D
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From: theBlackChocobo | Posted: 2/14/2003 8:27:21 PM
Hey amasawa, kip, banks, tim etc. If the creative genius seems to be slowing down, someone plz gimme permission to make a "praise for the tbj discoverers topic"... a sizable ego can help in these matters (plus it would be fun(ny) to do)
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From: theBlackChocobo | Posted: 2/14/2003 8:30:59 PM
oops, someone else will have to make it if i get permission (i have to go now)
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From: Snoopdigger XP | Posted: 2/14/2003 8:32:49 PM
Still trying for the Varia-less Magmoor run. Can't get very far, but stay posted. I think I am close to a breakthrough that will enable you to have 80% of your health at the monitor station. However, dodging the turrets are a challenge. If you get hit once, don't bother going on. Now, in a couple of days, I may be able to get through it, but that depends on 16 variables. If all of those are fulfilled, you should be able to get through. Oh, Zell99, I will be sure to get a video of that.
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<|0|> <|0|>
From: jalpie | Posted: 2/14/2003 8:51:50 PM
good job guys :)
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From: zell99 | Posted: 2/14/2003 9:03:22 PM
snoop, if you manage varia-less magmoor run, congrats ;) and I'll host your vid too! :P
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From: Paratroopa1 | Posted: 2/14/2003 9:07:34 PM
Geothermal Core w/o Boost Ball = Impossible.

Why? Simple.

Without the Boost Ball, you cannot raise the platforms. Problem is, to reveal the huge spider ball track and the door leading to the Plasma Beam, you have to place a morph ball bomb in a morph ball bomb hole, and there's no possible way you can get in that hole without raising the platform first.

I can't seem to jump to the third platform, anyway. I dunno if you could get up there with Grapple Beam or not...? (I didn't have the Grapple Beam with me while doing this)

Well, that means Boost Ball is definately, absolutely required. Oh well, it was fun. I might as well keep going and see what else I can do without Boost Ball, though.
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"I gets soooooooooooooo annoying!" ~ BlueWizard13
"I love to hear people praise me so please feel free to tell me how good I am." ~ jibtothemax
From: Phediuk | Posted: 2/14/2003 10:03:49 PM
Of course, people said it was absitively posolutely impossible to climb the Suntower without opening the runic gate...
---
"Thank you, Mario. But our princess is in another castle."
-Toad in Super Mario Bros.
From: Paratroopa1 | Posted: 2/14/2003 10:08:50 PM
Well, go take a look at Geothermal Core yourself then. Unless someone somehow gets up to the third platform (might be possible) and then invents the Quadecuple (fourteen) Bomb Jump or something, I think we're going to be needing the Boost Ball.
---
"I gets soooooooooooooo annoying!" ~ BlueWizard13
"I love to hear people praise me so please feel free to tell me how good I am." ~ jibtothemax
From: Amasawa | Posted: 2/14/2003 10:10:42 PM
Para, quit complaining and get to work on an infinite bomb jump immediately! ;-)
---
Metroid Prime Discoveries
http://membres.lycos.fr/zell99/metroid
From: SolrFlare | Posted: 2/14/2003 10:13:59 PM
Yeah Slacker! LOL j/k I'm more curious to see if SJ can be avoided if substituted for the grapple. Yeah that won't drop the percentage lower but it would be interesting.
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Solr_Flare
From: Amasawa | Posted: 2/14/2003 10:32:27 PM
yeah, me too Solr, although I think some e-tanks are necessary because you have to go through twin fires in order to continue ahead (observatory looks unclimbable past the last switch to activate it). There are a couple of things still standing in the way that I can't come up with a solution for, like how to get back up out of the frozen pike in phendrana, or out Tallon overworld beyond the crashed frigate. There's other stuff to deal with too, like how to get Strength artifact or how to climb the ominous-looking impact crater, but right now I'm just messing around to see how far I can get without it.
---
Metroid Prime Discoveries
http://membres.lycos.fr/zell99/metroid
From: keybladeswordsman | Posted: 2/14/2003 10:36:46 PM
Snoop, show me your data on your breakthrough to have 80 percent of your health at moniter station. It would be real useful.
From: Videogaming | Posted: 2/14/2003 11:24:30 PM
Really, REALLY sorry about this if it turns out to be true...

You know after you beat Flaahgra, you come to a tunnel room with 3 boxes in it? Well, those boxes ALWAYS give ultra energy and missiles. So, obviously, some of the power-ups different crates give are not random. So what if the crates in the Monitor Station ALWAYS give missiles, or only gives energy a certain % of the time?

Don't give up on the no-Varia run, but I think you should check out those crates on a normal, Varia-acquired game to check their power-ups. I would, but I'm too lazy.

BTW, I'm going to finish my 27% game but I don't think I'm going to go for 24%. I don't wanna spend hella time dealing with the Sunchamber, and I think Omega would make my ass an entree...
From: Zero IX | Posted: 2/15/2003 12:01:11 AM
Yah, but that's only true of some crates in my experience. I'm fairly certain that ultra energy will only appear if your energy is low, though. :(
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vincit omnia veritas
From: keybladeswordsman | Posted: 2/15/2003 8:13:45 AM
You sure? I got an ultra energy the first time I beat the plated beetle. Maybe the crate idea is right. It might allow us to finally to use missiles.

(runs off to check)

Keep posting some helpful information and I might make it to phendrana.
From: Suikunrules | Posted: 2/15/2003 8:21:07 AM
It's whiny boy again. Last night, I posted a question - the Observatory in the Phendrana Research Station seems to be impassable. I ask again in the hopes that someone's encountered this and can answer it.

If you want to see the epic tale I have done, check page 10 - if you have default page settings, it's at the bottom.

Since my last post, I've beaten Thardus for the Spider Ball, Omega Pirate for the Phazon Suit, and everything in between. (As a side note, the Power Bomb works well on OP, even on Hard. It caused a nice sizable chunk of damage every time I set one off - something around a fourth of his HP.)

I just checked the Observatory again, with every item I can think of except for the Super Missile and some Artifacts in my possession.

Nothing is different. The room is still impassable. I can't jump far enough to reach the platform that would let me to the top. Of course, that doesn't count the fact that the damned holographic display won't activate.

I think Zell answered my question already (referring to me as "sink" O_o), but that doesn't work. He said to

sink- you have to scan the computer on the ground level of the observatory. that will activate a morph ball slot on the wall, jump in it and bomb it. that will activate yet another morph ball slot a little higher, get there and bomb it. that will activate the 4 spinners on the ground, get in and boost them...

The problem is that the computer is NOT scannable. IIRC, the computer activates after you blast the two Pirates in the room. I have repeatedly burned them into oblivion with the Plasma Beam, and yet the computer never turns on. Without that to activate the slot, I can't continue.

Has anyone encountered this before? If so, how can I get past it?

---
Blah.
From: keybladeswordsman | Posted: 2/15/2003 8:29:46 AM
suikun, maybe it is your equipment. The game thinks you have some later upgrades it thinks you don't need to activate the machine anymore.(activate machines, get super missile, does'n activate anymore)Try using the wave, power beam, or missiles to kill the pirates.
From: Suikunrules | Posted: 2/15/2003 8:37:37 AM
Thanks, KBS. I'll try that as soon as my little brother stops playing his own Metroid Prime file. =P

---
Blah.
From: Snoopdigger XP | Posted: 2/15/2003 8:39:11 AM
Keybladeswordsman, the variables that you need in order to proceed deal largely with enemies giving off energies. 2 of the variables are already set, because the Magmoors give off 20 energy. The rest are up to you. You have to shoot enemies and suck their energy with your charge beam, while making your way to the door. It really all depends on whether the crates give you energy of missiles. I'm not sure about whether missiles effect it, but if they don't, I'm going to stock up on expansions and try those. Good luck to you. But if all of those variables fall in our favor, we still need to make the monitor station in about 25 seconds in order to survive transport access A. However, if you have 80 left in your tanks, go for the energy tank. That is all of the raw data I can give you.
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I am the Master, version XP.
<|0|> <|0|>
From: Suikunrules | Posted: 2/15/2003 8:52:21 AM
It didn't work.

I loaded my file again and happily anticipated getting my beloved Super Missile. I carefully made sure I had the Wave Beam out when I entered the Observatory. After a short skirmish, the last Pirate collapsed with a "rroargh"-like sound.

I grinned. Surely the stupid thing would activate now!

One second.

Two seconds.

Three.

No, the computer doesn't activate.

I suddenly have this urge to kill something.

I again ask:

Has anyone encountered this and/or know how to get past it?

---
Blah.
From: theBlackChocobo | Posted: 2/15/2003 11:41:22 AM
are you sure that the computer wasn't already activated and one of the slots is available? just checking...
---
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From: Suikunrules | Posted: 2/15/2003 12:17:24 PM
I'll double check, but I'm 99% certain that they aren't ready - hell, I have to use the Plasma Beam's light just to find them.

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Blah.
From: Suikunrules | Posted: 2/15/2003 12:31:34 PM
Nope, both of the Morph Ball Bomb slots are inactive. I also tried bombing while in them, just to see if there was a glitch of some sort and they were active but didn't show it, but nothing happened.

I also killed the Pirates that time with the Power Beam. I'm understandably not all too optimistic about blasting them with Missiles.

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Blah.
From: Amasawa | Posted: 2/15/2003 1:40:08 PM
Strange... If that's a glitch, Suikun, I haven't seen it before. I seriously doubt getting items early has anything to do with it... I've been through the observatory with all kinds of items I'm not supposed to have on various runs through the game, but not once have I run into this problem.

At the risk of being an irritating pain the ass by asking the obvious, are you sure you're looking at the right computer, the one right in the middle of the group of them? And this is after you've defeated all the pirates in the room and that frantic music that tries to annoy you to death comes to a (thankful) silence, correct? Because the order should be as follows: computer panel, then the morph bomb switch on the left (as you face toward the center of the room from where the computer is), then the morph ball switch on the right, and finally the four spinner devices around the equipment in the center of the room.

I'll try to upload some screenshots today to confirm each location to rule out the possibility of this just being something overlooked. If it really is a glitch, the best news I can give you is that the game can still be completed without the super missile. Unfortunately, knowing you can and actually doing it are separated by a very challenging bit of bomb jumping, so leaving that as a last resort is probably best.
---
Metroid Prime Discoveries
http://membres.lycos.fr/zell99/metroid
From: s742617000027s1 | Posted: 2/15/2003 2:32:49 PM
If I remember correctly, the 24% can be attained by having only 1 e-tank and 5 expansions. What exactly prevents from getting less than 5?
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-SHEATH THY BLADE!!! Bands you must listen too: Kreator, Slipknot, Tool, Meshuggah, System of a Down, Exmortem, The Berzerker.
From: Paratroopa1 | Posted: 2/15/2003 2:34:54 PM
No no no, 5 Missiles, not expansions. You can easily avoid all the Missile expansions.
---
"I gets soooooooooooooo annoying!" ~ BlueWizard13
"I love to hear people praise me so please feel free to tell me how good I am." ~ jibtothemax
From: Suikunrules | Posted: 2/15/2003 2:55:17 PM
Well, Amasawa, I really appreciate trying, but I'm sure. It's smack dab in the middle of the consoles on the side of the room opposite the entrance, and there's a purposeful-looking black rectangle (like the grates where Power Conduits are, except it's not a grate).

I'm pretty sure that everything is going as you describe it; again, I'll re-check (although at this point, I'll be obscenely embarrassed if I'm being stupid =P). However, yes, the blissful silence is not accompanied by the computer activating.

Actually, Amasawa, I think you're wrong about this file being complete-able. I know about bypassing the Runic Gate in the Suntower, but this is different. Beyond the Observatory is the Control Tower, where you get the Artifact of Elder. I can't go through Research Lab Aether, as the glass hasn't been broken - the first Metroid you're supposed to see is still happily floating around in his (hers? its?) stasis tank. Since the Observatory is impassable, I can't get to the Tower for my Artifact, thereby preventing completion of the game.

For what it's worth, perhaps getting the Thermal Visor or something is screwing up the order. The Super Missile is the last thing I tried to get before Thardus - maybe one of those items (Beam combos, X-Ray/Thermal Visor, Power Bombs...) triggers something.

I was glancing through my Bradygames MP guide (yes, I have one, stop laughing =P) when it mentioned that when you go back through the station after getting the Visor, Sentry Drones appear in the tunnel before the Observatory. Originally, there are Auto Defense Turrets in the room. I think the trigger that replaces the Turrets might be messing with the sequence in the room. If so, isolating it could prevent further problems in the future for other diehard skippers.

It occurs to me that, since I'm the only one who's run into this, it might seem like I'm lying. I'm not, really. Why would I lie about getting MYSELF stuck? O_o

---
Blah.
From: Qmark | Posted: 2/15/2003 4:34:46 PM
In other news, my number of failed attempts at early plasma has reached 2000...

I hate that spider block.
From: zell99 | Posted: 2/15/2003 4:53:06 PM
suikenrules- sorry for calling you "sink" but it's more fun =P hum... your problem is... problematic.. can't see what may be the problem, except maybe what you mentionned (when the change occures turret/sentry drones) but what is the problem with getting artifact from the back way? i did it alot of times.. =/
---
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http://membres.lycos.fr/zellmetroid - http://membres.lycos.fr/zell99/metroid
From: kip | Posted: 2/15/2003 4:57:06 PM
"In other news, my number of failed attempts at early plasma has reached 2000..."

is your first jump always started against the wall for extra height?

also, have you watched zell's videos of it?
From: Amasawa | Posted: 2/15/2003 4:57:23 PM
Very strange. Nah, I don't think you're lying (like ya pointed out, why would you be?) I think maybe you're one very unlucky SOB, but that's about it. =)

The glass does break; don't worry. Sometimes going through the back way, the pirate won't break the glass -- this is an inconsistancy that hasn't been nailed down yet, but it's correctable by simply backing up a couple of rooms to get the room with the glass to reload, and then try again. It definitely works though -- I've gone in the back way before, as a matter of fact, without activating the machine in the observatory AT ALL, and been able to get Elder with no problem. You'll need to go through twin fires in magmoor to do it, but I assure you it's very doable, and the game is definitely completeable without climbing the observatory at all.

That being said, this still puzzles me and I'm really interested in confirming all the details, if nothing else so as to prevent this happening from anyone else, so I'm gonna get going on the screenshots and upload 'em shortly and I'd appreciate it if you get a minute to check 'em just to make sure. Thanks in advance.
---
Metroid Prime Discoveries
http://membres.lycos.fr/zell99/metroid
From: s742617000027s1 | Posted: 2/15/2003 5:09:26 PM
No no no, 5 Missiles, not expansions. You can easily avoid all the Missile expansions.

Ack, your right! Lol sorry my bad ^_^

---
-SHEATH THY BLADE!!! Bands you must listen too: Kreator, Slipknot, Tool, Meshuggah, System of a Down, Exmortem, The Berzerker.
From: theBlackChocobo | Posted: 2/15/2003 5:16:48 PM
kip, FYI, zell's vids do not show jumping on the block itself, maybe he should make a new video or something, it seems like he forgot about that all-important jump...
---
Congratulations! You have won $1,000,000 from a lottery you didn't enter!! Send me $240,000 to pay the taxes and claim the prize!!
From: Psycho Falcon | Posted: 2/15/2003 5:28:02 PM
Suikunrules: I think you nailed it in that last post about the Thermal Visor sequence. The Thermal causes two or three Shadow Pirates to appear in that room, correct? If not, let me just say something.

I came to get the Super Missile the same you did, through the back, except I didn't want the Thermal Visor. When I dropped into the room, (landing on the bottom floor if it matters) 3 Pirates appeared. After killing them, the monitor activated, but the other two pirates were still "working" at their computers, and were very much alive.

The important part is that either those 3 Pirates triggered it, or killing all ACTIVE Pirates, (Active meaning offensive AI, animation, etc.),(Also considering you normally have to kill all 5... I think) triggered it, considering the other two pirates' trigger is either of them being shot, or walking at in the hallway from the front door.

Whatever Pirates are present after the Visor probably don't carry the same trigger(s), because the possibility of Active Pirates being trigger, seems to make other come into play, like the Thermal Visor.

One last thing I just thought of: I don't think you can kill 5 pirates in that room more than once, can you? Even before the Thermal Visor, right?
From: Amasawa | Posted: 2/15/2003 5:33:46 PM
k, Suikun, please check the pictures located below when you get a chance, and verify that your game does not look like this (i.e. hologram active and spinner arms locked down). Sorry for the painfully obvious questions; it's just that to nail this stuff down, it's better in my experience to cover every question to make sure that nothing's overlooked.

http://www.geocities.com/amasawa42/MPObserv01.JPG
http://www.geocities.com/amasawa42/MPObserv02.JPG

Once you confirm that the holo's not active, I'll pester you with some other questions.
---
Metroid Prime Discoveries
http://membres.lycos.fr/zell99/metroid
From: Qmark | Posted: 2/15/2003 6:26:50 PM
Aha! pressing against the wall _does_ add quite a bit of height. This may also prove usefull for making the gravity-less lifegiver jump more consistant.

Whoever mentioned jumping against the wall has my eternal gratitude. Zell's description was unclear about that, and the video really needs to have more before that jump (as in where to stand, etc), instead of after (opening the door).

I still hate that spider block.
From: Amasawa | Posted: 2/15/2003 6:29:02 PM
It does indeed. Using that knowledge can not only get you lifegiver consistently, it can allow you pass through many other underwater areas you otherwise couldn't without the gravity suit... including the frigate. =)
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Metroid Prime Discoveries
http://membres.lycos.fr/zell99/metroid
From: TreborSelbon | Posted: 2/15/2003 7:14:43 PM
I think I've figured a sure-fire way to get through Hydro Access. Maybe sure-fire is the wrong word, but it worked for me on a consistent basis (about 1 out of 3 tries once I could get it started).

I was at the E-tank. Push and hold up. Start charging B. Now, hold down to roll forward. Release B before you think Samus is touching the wall (you need to release it as close to the wall as possible). If you time it perfectly, you'll go down a long way. If not, you'll go down a short way, which is fine. Anyway, keep holding down and charge B. What you want to do is hit down right as you release B. Therefore, you need to release down literally a split second before B, then hit down again. You should get a huge boost. Repeat on the way down. From the top, it takes 3 of these big boosts.

I tried to go back to try some more, but apparantly you can't go down the other side....

Like I said, this seemed to work very well for me. Would anyone like to try this method and tell me how it goes?

---
Real programmers don't comment their code. If it was hard to write, it should be hard to understand.
From: TreborSelbon | Posted: 2/15/2003 7:37:19 PM
A little tweak: After the first boost and you're clinging to the wall, don't release down all the way any more for the rest of the trip. Just let go a little, release b, and push down all the way again. Using this method, I got it to work within my first couple of tries.

---
Real programmers don't comment their code. If it was hard to write, it should be hard to understand.
From: NeoMechaSonic | Posted: 2/15/2003 7:44:43 PM
I still can't do the tbj...I suck. =(
---
"I'm not going there to die. I'm going there to see if I really am alive." - Spike Spigel
Current Status: I dunno...
From: keybladeswordsman | Posted: 2/15/2003 7:46:04 PM
BTW, in other news.....

varia-less magmoor life span has been from 80 seconds to 70 seconds.Thats one whole tank!!

Snoop inspired me to do this. You deserve some credit.
People who conribute can join the club.

Note

LOTS OF FREE FOOD. COOL STUFF. MEMBERS ONLY OR THE SNIPER BOTS WILL ELIMINATE YOU.
From: Amasawa | Posted: 2/15/2003 7:59:48 PM
trebor -- thanks for the tips; I'll try 'em out next time I have to clunk my way through there again. I'll be bugging you again when i have questions. =)
---
Metroid Prime Discoveries
http://membres.lycos.fr/zell99/metroid
From: keybladeswordsman | Posted: 2/15/2003 9:10:34 PM
ANOTHER 5 SECONDS!!!!!!!!! HOW FAR CAN I GO????????!!!!!!!
I SHAVED 5 SECONDS! HOORAY!!

I'M ON SUGAR HIGH AND I'M CRAZY!!!

65 seconds on the wall, 65 seconds...........
From: Snoopdigger XP | Posted: 2/15/2003 9:42:40 PM
Okay, we have got 65 seconds. I am trying to find a way to cut down on shooting the Magmoors and shoot the crates only. But that requires a lot of luck in getting energies. If all of the crates are energies, that would make the run 47 seconds, give or take a few.
---
I am the Master, version XP.
<|0|> <|0|>
From: Mario Cleanstuff | Posted: 2/15/2003 9:53:55 PM
Well... Monday's out of the question. Tuesday, though...

Wish me luck! And speed! And more luck! And no older brother around to tattle on me!

HOO-AH!

---
"I tend to procrastinate, and sometimes I even put that off." -Me
Whoosh. 'Splode. Sploosh. Squat. CALL ME STUPID!!!
From: Suikunrules | Posted: 2/16/2003 5:03:42 AM
Sorry for not posting, I've been sleeping. Darned bodily functions getting in the way of my Metroid Prime time! O_o

The glass does break; don't worry. Sometimes going through the back way, the pirate won't break the glass -- this is an inconsistancy that hasn't been nailed down yet, but it's correctable by simply backing up a couple of rooms to get the room with the glass to reload, and then try again. It definitely works though -- I've gone in the back way before, as a matter of fact, without activating the machine in the observatory AT ALL, and been able to get Elder with no problem. You'll need to go through twin fires in magmoor to do it, but I assure you it's very doable, and the game is definitely completeable without climbing the observatory at all.

WOOHOOOOOOOOO!!

Sorry, I didn't know that XD. So I can just go through the back way several times until some idjit Pirate breaks it. Yaaaaay!

k, Suikun, please check the pictures located below when you get a chance, and verify that your game does not look like this (i.e. hologram active and spinner arms locked down). Sorry for the painfully obvious questions; it's just that to nail this stuff down, it's better in my experience to cover every question to make sure that nothing's overlooked.

Both of those pictures are after the computer has been activated. My holographic display is not working, and the Spinner bracket things are up, forming a square around the lower part of the engine. And I would notice those planets going around, I think ^_^;. I have gone through this game before, y'know =P.

Psycho Falcon, you typed too much for me to make a concise and reasonably short quote. =P But yes, that's what I was thinking about the triggers and stuff. No idea about killing five Pirates, though.

And thanks to everyone for helping me; it feels so weird to have the people who inspired me to skip/get before it's normally possible everything I could investigate a glitch I ran into. O_o

(Incidentally, Amasawa helped me in a topic of mine asking about completing a 27% game. This is twice, then. I owe ya something now XD!)

---
Blah.
From: Amasawa | Posted: 2/16/2003 10:04:32 AM
*scratches his head

OK, I'm convinced. Yeah, it was a dumb question so I deserve ragging for that; thanks for humoring me though.

Very strange. I guess you really ARE an unlucky SOB then. ;) Weeeeelllll... looks like this one's gonna take some looking into. Wish I had a better answer for ya, but this one's news to me. Maybe I should do a runthrough and get every item I possibly can before going through the base to see if I can duplicate the glitch. I'll let you know if I have any (un?)luck.
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Metroid Prime Discoveries
http://membres.lycos.fr/zell99/metroid
From: theBlackChocobo | Posted: 2/16/2003 10:08:43 AM
off the topic, but where did Sodohobo's "Amawasa" [sic] topic go?
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Everyone is Unique.
From: phazonmetroid | Posted: 2/16/2003 10:14:48 AM
^^I was wondering the same thing^^
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Currently Playing: Metroid Prime 5%(Hard Mode), Metroid Fusion 100%, SSB:M 280 Trophys, SA2:B 106 Emblems, LoZ:LTTP
From: annoynweirdklown | Posted: 2/16/2003 10:22:07 AM
i think deleted like all the other ones
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Clowns are NOT scary...non-clowns are.
From: keybladeswordsman | Posted: 2/16/2003 10:41:50 AM
TIME BEING, 60 SEC. HOORAY.

varialess magmoor is almost possible now. But we still have to shave off another 20 sec......

(At the feast)
*Where is everybody? I think Sodohobo is gone and there is no flames but LOTS of food!!!*
(cricket chirps in background)

Can someone help me at twin fires? the second bomb does not push me up more.....
From: Amasawa | Posted: 2/16/2003 10:48:35 AM
wow, you're that close? nice work!

for twin fires, try delaying your last bomb (the one in midair) so that you're setting it just as you're starting to fall back down. the drag of the lava slows you a bit and this should compensate for it (or is something else going on? you did say "second" bomb but I just figured you meant the one in midair)
---
Metroid Prime Discoveries
http://membres.lycos.fr/zell99/metroid
From: annoynweirdklown | Posted: 2/16/2003 10:52:47 AM
yep tons of food any really big temples and shrines to honer the great gods *starts to eat food*
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Clowns are NOT scary...non-clowns are.
From: Suikunrules | Posted: 2/16/2003 11:52:30 AM
Minor report: The glitch is still active in my skip file's Observatory; it might be a rogue trigger of some sort from an earlier version or a certain-game-specific glitch (if that's possible).

The "rogue trigger" is something like Research Lab Aether. Release one of the two Metroids on the lower level and scan 'em - strangely, you won't have a Metroid scan. Apparently, they were at first Alpha Metroids instead of original!

Speaking of Aether, I've gone through it about four times now to hope for the glass to break. It hasn't happened yet, unfortunately. If it matters, I've been reloading it by going back to Research Core, letting the Metroid inside break the glass, then heading back to the Labs. I kill every Pirate in the room, and occasionally one of the "Alpha" Metroids. Is it just unlikely to occur, or is there something I'm missing?

---
Blah.
From: Suikunrules | Posted: 2/16/2003 12:07:06 PM
This post is utterly pointless, but I just finished looking at funkytoad's sig while waiting for zell's site to load.

*insert obscene amount of ROFL's and LOL's here*

If anyone doesn't get that, look at the letters in his alphabet in his sig that aren't supposed to be there.

XD

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Blah.
From: SuperSayian | Posted: 2/16/2003 12:23:18 PM
IM STUCK!!! At least I think I am...

Ok, I am at the save right next to the Power Bombs and I have no Spider Bombs. How can I get out of the Phazon Mines?

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If a chick ever complains about being "fat" just tell her you know an exercise that burns 500 calories an hour..
From: annoynweirdklown | Posted: 2/16/2003 12:26:13 PM
you go back and find the xray visor
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Clowns are NOT scary...non-clowns are.
From: montypylon10189 | Posted: 2/16/2003 1:10:11 PM
LOL! I just looked at his sig too. "I am Satan." Thats hilarious.
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Metroid Prime- Hard-100%, Hard-24%, Normal 2:21 SMS-117 shines SFA-99% SSBM- 287trophies SA2:B- 175 emblems MLB Slugfest 2003- Allstar season 52-0
From: Amasawa | Posted: 2/16/2003 1:24:16 PM
suikun-- try varying the amount of time it takes you to get to the top of Aether. Try running up there as fast as you can, and if that doesn't work, try taking your time waiting for the baddies to come to you. I know it doesn't sound like it makes a lot of sense, but I'm starting to see enough of this stuff that I'm convinced now that this makes a difference.

Going back to research core for the reload is fine; I know that's what I do if I ever need to, at least.
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Metroid Prime Discoveries
http://membres.lycos.fr/zell99/metroid
From: Amasawa | Posted: 2/16/2003 1:26:19 PM
SuperSaiyan -- kip's got a way to climb the phazon processing center w/o spider ball, so head back that way and I'll help you with it if you want; I was just experimenting with that trick myself last night. The strategy's listed under tricky rooms on the site, so take a look at that first if you can.
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Metroid Prime Discoveries
http://membres.lycos.fr/zell99/metroid
From: Swimmerboy | Posted: 2/16/2003 1:56:36 PM
OMG, this hit page 2!!!!! _.-._Bump_.-._
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I have found that the wavebird wireless controllers suck, there is no cord to stop it from hitting the wall when u get really angry and throw it...
From: SuperSayian | Posted: 2/16/2003 2:02:22 PM
no kidding? Clime up that room? Wow... I will check it out at the site.. THX
---
If a chick ever complains about being "fat" just tell her you know an exercise that burns 500 calories an hour..
From: Mario Cleanstuff | Posted: 2/16/2003 3:04:18 PM
EEP! PAGE 2 ALERT!

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"I tend to procrastinate, and sometimes I even put that off." -Me
Whoosh. 'Splode. Sploosh. Squat. CALL ME STUPID!!! HOO-AH!!!
From: Mario Cleanstuff | Posted: 2/16/2003 3:37:26 PM
Too close to page 2...

---
"I tend to procrastinate, and sometimes I even put that off." -Me
Whoosh. 'Splode. Sploosh. Squat. CALL ME STUPID!!! HOO-AH!!!
From: Mario Cleanstuff | Posted: 2/16/2003 5:37:23 PM
On page 2...

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"I tend to procrastinate, and sometimes I even put that off." -Me
Whoosh. 'Splode. Sploosh. Squat. CALL ME STUPID!!! HOO-AH!!!
From: annoynweirdklown | Posted: 2/16/2003 7:11:41 PM
on page 2 again....
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Clowns are NOT scary...non-clowns are.
From: zell99 | Posted: 2/16/2003 8:46:09 PM
set your options to 50 topics/messages per page. it will rarely hit page 2 that way.
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http://membres.lycos.fr/zell99/metroid
The Rooling Guy seems as clear as Collin Powell's satellite pictures... -Blue Gaspagos
From: Swimmerboy | Posted: 2/16/2003 10:10:41 PM
BuMp
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I have found that the wavebird wireless controllers suck, there is no cord to stop it from hitting the wall when u get really angry and throw it...
From: Ragnarok72 | Posted: 2/16/2003 10:12:47 PM
Hey zell, guess what? It hit page two again. :p

Anyway, I'm currently starting a new file on Normal difficulty, to take advantage of other stuff like SJ before Flaahgrhaa (just add an "e-i-e-i-o" to it and it'll be spelt right....:p), and I shall be adding my (somewhat limited, I'll admit) expertise to making the Magmoor w/o Varia run this time around, to see if I can do it.
From: Suikunrules | Posted: 2/17/2003 4:25:39 AM
I'm awake once again (whee) to do three things.

One, point out that it's spelled Flaahgra.

Flaahgra.

Say it with me!

"Flaahgra!"

I think, anyway XD.

Two, to say that I didn't make any progress into the Control Tower, as I was playing Kingdom Hearts =P.

Three, to bump this up from its standard-page-settings page-2-ness.

*insert funny bump message here*

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Blah.
From: ShOcKeR oF cHaOs | Posted: 2/17/2003 10:55:07 AM
bump
---
"Why don't you have something to drink? Choose one making you better feeling!" -Tom Green
From: Ragnarok72 | Posted: 2/17/2003 12:24:45 PM
>I'm awake once again (whee) to do three things.

One, point out that it's spelled Flaahgra.

Flaahgra.

Say it with me!

"Flaahgra!"

I think, anyway XD.

I'd like to take the time to point out that we now have evidence that the character name-guy at Retro Studios must have been on SOMETHING when he came up with that name!

Oh, and in case you don't know, you've just read a cleverly disguised BUMP.
From: annoynweirdklown | Posted: 2/17/2003 3:08:22 PM
BUMP
made it to page 1(bottom) (50 topics per page)
made it to page 1 (really bottom) (40 topics per page)
made it to page 2 (30 topics per page)
made it to page 3 (20 topics per page)
made it to page 4 (10 topics per page)
there so that way everyone will know that it reached somewhere
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Clowns are NOT scary...non-clowns are.
From: Griffin5150 | Posted: 2/17/2003 8:33:28 PM
Ahkay. If you've been following Wu's topic on how he managed to get through Magmoor Caverns through the magic of lying through his teeth and saying "RUN YOUR ASS OFF, IDJUT!", you'll have seen that I've been having a few doubts about the 24% game. I've visited Zell's website, and while I don't think that anything on that site was done through the PAR*, I left the site unsatisfied, since it just mentioned something about needing the spider ball to do a trick in the suntower if you're skipping the charge beam and super missles. Now, I have a few questions.

1) What is this Suntower trick, exactly? I can't see any way outside of warping somehow to get past the mosiac.

2) In several places in this game (outside the Research Station\Quarantine Cave, Suntower, etc.), you need to break Cordite junk in order to proceed. What about these locations?

Thank you in advance!

*-Pro Action Replay, or what was produced on the SNES. Yeah, I'm an old geezer and an emulation junkie at the shockingly old age of 15 364/365. *rolls eyes*
---
"We are all bound by our experiences. They are the limits of our consciousness. But in the end, the human soul will ever reach for the truth..." -Samus Aran
From: SolrFlare | Posted: 2/17/2003 8:36:47 PM
Click on the Super Missles link in the Skip section and read through that in detail then feel free to ask any other questions if you need clarification. Basically you only need the charge beam because oyou need super missles for that one room. However you can use bomb jumping similar to the Tripple Bomb Jump wwhile on the rail to actually get past the rune gate thingy.

Since oyu no longer need to break open the cordite in the room, you no longer need Super missles, and thus, no longer need the charge beam. And yes its beatable without it..but its not fun to play heh.
---
Solr_Flare
From: Amasawa | Posted: 2/17/2003 8:37:57 PM
Griffin -- there is a section on the site dedicated to skipping the super missiles/charge beam with information on how to climb the sun tower. The trick involved using bombs to jump up past the runic gate, so that the runes never need to be scanned (and hence the cordite covers do not need to be destroyed)

The cordite cover blocking the conduit that powers the door to the room before quarantine cave is not a problem either, because with the ice beam you can simply go through the research labs and open the ice door in the room where the thermal visor is, then continue on and climb the Frozen Pike to reach Thardus from the "back route" (There is another way to reach him through Magmoor as well, but I won't elaborate unless you ask)

Please check the site carefully. Zell has put a lot of time into making sure critical information is there, so if there's anything unclear I'm sure he'd like to hear about it.
---
Metroid Prime Discoveries
http://membres.lycos.fr/zell99/metroid
From: joshuajw | Posted: 2/17/2003 8:42:33 PM
Griffon - If you're stilling doubting that a 24% game is possible, then here is Amasawa's (note: NOT mine) screenshot of the Mission Complete screen with 24%.

http://www.geocities.com/amasawa42/MP_N24In547.jpg

---
I'm going to Hell; who's coming with me?
From: CALFoolio | Posted: 2/17/2003 8:47:39 PM
1) The trick in the sun tower room is to get from the bottom of the room to the top without activating the runic symbols to get rid of the gate.

The technique is very similar to a triple bomb jump. you're first bomb does nothing. lay it anywhere and then head for the top of the spider ball track under the runic gate. then lay the 2nd and 3rd bombs along the top. if you time them correctly, your bombs will refill right after you lay your 3rd bomb. then lay the 4th, 5th, 6th, bombs along the runic gate when the 2nd and 3rd propel you up it. if they're placed correctly, the bombs will knock you over the runic gate and you can latch onto the spider ball above it.

now you can get back into the sunchamber to ge tthe artifact of wild without needing super missiles.

2) you don't need any super missiles to get into the research area in phendrana. you do need super missiles if you want to enter the quarantine cave from the front entrance. BUT the quarantine cave has a back entrance too. if you get the ice beam early, you can exit the research area through the ice door at the bottom of the room with the thermal visor. that takes you to the frozen pike, which leads to the back entrance of the quarantine cave. that way, you don't need any super missiles to fight thardus either.

---
http://www.ocf.berkeley.edu/~henhen/ssbm/
BtT: 3:36.03 HRC: 86644.8 ft
From: TreborSelbon | Posted: 2/17/2003 9:10:52 PM
I finally discovered something. All on my own. Now, I know this doesn't cut the percent down or anything, but it'll help a ton in speed runs and in a low percent run.

By now, I'm sure you know those Wave Troopers on the second level of Elite Research don't appear until you activate the first set of platforms. I spent 2 hours trying to figure a way to get up to the second level without activating them, thus, eliminating the need to bother with the Troopers. The down side is you still have to fight the Power Trooper at the top.

Anyway, when you first enter the room, you'll notice that it's octagonal shaped. The sides to the left and right of the one straight ahead have flat, vertical, rectangular panels on them. You can do this from either side, I think. Go around the back of one and space jump onto the little orange-looking panel. From there, space jump up to the rail above it (you should still be on the panel back of the panel, not the top). Walk to the end of this rail (away from the other panel and the computer terminals on the second floor). Look out around the edge of the open area and you'll notice a conveniently placed pipe that looks sort of like a lightning bolt (you can't miss it). The goal is to jump on it. L-lock your view down, jump around the panel you are standing on (you'll have to move left first, then forward), then double jump onto the flat part of the pipe. No L-lock spring jump required; the looking down is just to line it up properly. From here, it's just a simple space jump to the platform in the middle and, thus, to the computer terminals to activate the platforms to the top floor.

There might be a way to get up to the very top without activating the platforms but there's no point, as the Power Trooper is there regardless.

This may seem overly complicated, but it's not; believe me. This can shave of a couple of minutes as well as save you life (think 24% trying to kill both Wave Troopers).

---
Real programmers don't comment their code. If it was hard to write, it should be hard to understand.
From: Griffin5150 | Posted: 2/17/2003 9:11:32 PM
Ah, Okay. Thanks for the tips! *sigh* I knew I shoulda went over that site more clearly, but NOOOO... >_<
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"We are all bound by our experiences. They are the limits of our consciousness. But in the end, the human soul will ever reach for the truth..." -Samus Aran
From: Mario Cleanstuff | Posted: 2/17/2003 9:58:59 PM
bumpers

---
"I tend to procrastinate, and sometimes I even put that off." -Me
Whoosh. 'Splode. Sploosh. Squat. CALL ME STUPID!!! HOO-AH!!!
From: Mario Cleanstuff | Posted: 2/17/2003 10:28:07 PM
Wish me luck on my no varia magmoor runs tomorrow by typing "62" at the end of your posts (I got it in my sig)!

Oh, and bumps for the topic.

---
"I tend to procrastinate, and sometimes I even put that off." -Me
Whoosh. 'Splode. Sploosh. Squat. 62 CALL ME STUPID!!! HOO-AH!!!
From: Mario Cleanstuff | Posted: 2/18/2003 12:10:07 AM
bump62bump!

---
"I tend to procrastinate, and sometimes I even put that off." -Me
Whoosh. 'Splode. Sploosh. Squat. 62 CALL ME STUPID!!! HOO-AH!!!
From: jamescom1 | Posted: 2/18/2003 12:22:41 AM
62!

By the way, did you know that if you don't have a lowercase letter in your post, then your post is in all uppercase?
From: Mario Cleanstuff | Posted: 2/18/2003 12:24:29 AM
Did you know that if you don't have a lowercase letter in your post, then your post won't be posted?

I found out how to beat the game with only getting 12 log book entries! YAY ME!

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"I tend to procrastinate, and sometimes I even put that off." -Me
Whoosh. 'Splode. Sploosh. Squat. 62 CALL ME STUPID!!! HOO-AH!!!
From: zell99 | Posted: 2/18/2003 7:48:55 AM
are you ever forced to get a logbook entry?
---
http://membres.lycos.fr/zell99/metroid
The Rooling Guy seems as clear as Collin Powell's satellite pictures... -Blue Gaspagos
From: Phediuk | Posted: 2/18/2003 8:40:10 AM
The Metroid in Research Lab Aether.
---
"Thank you, Mario. But our princess is in another castle."
-Toad in Super Mario Bros.
From: Mario Cleanstuff | Posted: 2/18/2003 9:16:52 AM
No... If you get an artifact, look at your log book if you haven't scanned the totems.

---
"I tend to procrastinate, and sometimes I even put that off." -Me
Whoosh. 'Splode. Sploosh. Squat. 62 CALL ME STUPID!!! HOO-AH!!!
From: densetsumanaman | Posted: 2/18/2003 9:20:06 AM
Funkytoad

Btw, I'm a moron...

No you're not...you're SATAN
---
~~Golden Sun Mage~~Member #09-densetsumanaman
--~\_=Member of the Golden Sun SWAT--Ascetic Code Yellow Captain=_/~--
From: tlj9204 | Posted: 2/18/2003 11:03:32 AM
Zell: the only one I can think of is the Parasite Queen, since it seems to take about 30 seconds to a minute longer to kill that boss without being able to lock onto its mouth. Other than that, running through all Pirate Data, Chozo Lore, Research Logs, and Creature Morphology, I don't think you're "forced" to pick up any Log Book data. Heck, my last speed run, I only scanned the Parasite Queen, so...

-Tim
---
IRC channel: #MetroidPrime
Prime Discoveries: http://membres.lycos.fr/zell99/metroid
From: Amasawa | Posted: 2/18/2003 11:20:05 AM
yeah, but like Mario's pointing out, getting the artifacts automatically adds log book entries... are you guys just talking about creatures or something?
---
Metroid Prime Discoveries
http://membres.lycos.fr/zell99/metroid
From: Mario Cleanstuff | Posted: 2/18/2003 12:06:10 PM
Could somebody please draw me up a poorly designed ASCII diagram for SJ early? I'm having trouble with it.

---
"I tend to procrastinate, and sometimes I even put that off." -Me
Whoosh. 'Splode. Sploosh. Squat. 62 CALL ME STUPID!!! HOO-AH!!!
From: RockMFR 5 | Posted: 2/18/2003 12:14:19 PM
The only ones you are forced to get are the Artifacts. They are automatically recorded in your log book.

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<AC-927><SSBM-290><P9-DC><SMB-MASTER><SMB2-MASTER EXTRA><MKSC-WRx?> o_0
OHIO STATE-31 miami-24
From: Mario Cleanstuff | Posted: 2/18/2003 1:53:10 PM
bump

---
"I tend to procrastinate, and sometimes I even put that off." -Me
Whoosh. 'Splode. Sploosh. Squat. 62 CALL ME STUPID!!! HOO-AH!!!
From: Gold Leader | Posted: 2/18/2003 4:27:17 PM
I am going to start a 24% game. any tips?
---
Todays board hero is: Amasawa.Found on the Metriod Prime board. If this is you, come claim your prize at board: 19931
From: Diffusion | Posted: 2/18/2003 4:46:12 PM
Don't go insane. Drink lots of fluids. Use cover to your advantage.

---
She dates losers. I mean, what kind of guy gets it for "attempted" rape? - doomsdays
From: Snoopdigger XP | Posted: 2/18/2003 4:51:59 PM
Wish me luck on my next Varia-less attempt.
---
I am the Master, version XP.
<|0|> <|0|>
From: Snoopdigger XP | Posted: 2/18/2003 5:04:30 PM
Oh my God!

I was doing my first run through Magmoor Caverns w/o the Varia suit, when the freakiest thing happened to me. I found another glitch! ^_^

When I was going through the fiery shores, there is a path you need to follow above he lava. I was going through it, but I screwed up earlier and didn't make it. Well, just as I was about to die, I fell into the lava, and I pressed Y on accident. Well, the power bomb sequence started up! Isn't that cool. Well, if anyone can confirm this, that would be great.
---
I am the Master, version XP.
<|0|> <|0|>
From: funkytoad | Posted: 2/18/2003 5:19:25 PM
If you die as a morph ball, you explode like a power bomb ;p
---
ABICDEAFGHMIJKSLMNAOPQTRSTAUVWNXYZ
http://www.dallasmac.com/acc/catalog.php?user=137
From: Videogaming | Posted: 2/18/2003 5:28:46 PM
Thats not a glitch, although I know of one...When you are about to die in morph ball form (like at about 50 energy if you're rolling around in the phazon in the Impact Crater), then the "dying" screen will go somewhat slower for some reason.

Cleanstuff- Solrflare did some pretty good early sj ascii in v. 4.0 of this topic. If anybody has it saved, ask them, or Solrflare might have a copy of it...
From: Snoopdigger XP | Posted: 2/18/2003 6:12:08 PM
Cleanstuff, go to Zell99's site. There is a movie that shows you how to do it.
---
I am the Master, version 62.
<|0|> <|0|>
From: Suporuko | Posted: 2/18/2003 7:10:39 PM
Can anyone help me on getting the plasma beam without the spider ball? I can't for the life of me get up to the first block from the metal rim. And I have watched the movie at the website a few times but I might as well watch it a few more.
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Well, 1 out of 3 ain't bad. Actually, its only 33%, but it could be worse. - Soul Music by Terry Pratchett
From: Ragnarok72 | Posted: 2/18/2003 7:24:05 PM
Hey, I just had an idea that could shave off possibly 3 seconds in the Magmoor run, provided you already have the Space Jump.

The Place: Monitor Station. You know how normally you'd need to jump on those ledges on the wall and follow the wall until you reach the place where you could normally single-jump onto the station's second-floor catwalk?

Well, you can take a shorcut by only hopping up a few of the ledges on that wall, turn, and Space Jump onto the Catwalk, and continue running like your pants are on fire. :p

There IS a possible downside to this: there's an auto turrent over the second level catwalk that starts to target you when you start scaling the wall. At the area of the wall in which you draw fire from it, that's possibly the earliest part from which you can space jump to it; unfortunately, if you don't kill it first, then you basically have to hope it doesn't hit you a point blank. :D

Anyway, Kip? Amasawa? Banks? Do you have any idea what I'm talking about?

I've done this several times with the varia on, I currently haven't acquired the Space Jump Early yet, so I can't test how well it will affect the Varia-less run...
From: uncomfortable | Posted: 2/18/2003 7:29:03 PM
I tried looking for contact information on the metroid discoveries website, but apparently this is the only way I can share my info. I found a way (who knows if its been done before) to look straight up or down. Face an object with the scan visor on that displays an icon, one that can be scanned. Instead of scanning it, tap A to take out your gun, and quickly press and hold L. This should lock you onto the object and create a target (the same "+" you see when L-locking the view, but up close youll see its a notched ring with two arrows pointing at the center). This target has some interesting properties. For one, you can see it through any surface or object. If you get close to it and touch it, if its below a certain height it will move straight down away from you until its quite a distance away, you will then be looking directly at the ground, and vice versa if its above a certain height. I don't know if this can help at all, or if its just fun to mess around with. Facing directly down can make some jumps easier, if more confusing. And facing straight up could make killing enemies on vertical surfaces easier. Let me know if anyone finds anything new or useful about this.
From: Mojoman14 | Posted: 2/18/2003 7:36:25 PM
Uh, even if you can get through Magmoor without Varia, won't you eventually need to go back in anyway for various items?
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Well, at least we gots some COCONUTS!- Some guy on the street with coconut shoes
From: Suporuko | Posted: 2/18/2003 7:44:48 PM
I think the theory is that you can get more energy tanks before having to go back through again Mojo.
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Well, 1 out of 3 ain't bad. Actually, its only 33%, but it could be worse. - Soul Music by Terry Pratchett
From: Suporuko | Posted: 2/18/2003 7:52:40 PM
Nvm, against all odds I got up there just barely by ending up landing on that little post sticking out of the square and walking up.
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Well, 1 out of 3 ain't bad. Actually, its only 33%, but it could be worse. - Soul Music by Terry Pratchett
From: Mario Cleanstuff | Posted: 2/18/2003 8:44:37 PM
See second siggy quote.

---
"I tend to procrastinate, and sometimes I even put that off." -Me "BOOMP! thiaes toppick needseses two stae alyve!"-Me on the MP board
HOO-AH!!!
From: shadowptnp | Posted: 2/19/2003 12:46:25 AM
Quick, help me get the plasma beam before going to the Phazon Mines! I can't find any other topic covering it (damn lack of 75 karma).
---
Samus and Zelda, sitting in a tree, K-I-S-S-I-N-G.
Jesus just beat a Metroid?! Wow, guess I chose the right religion. -wasabimilkshake
From: Banks17 | Posted: 2/19/2003 12:53:23 AM
Ragnarok72: The problem is, most of us die when first stepping into the monitor station. *shrug*

If we were to somehow find a way to take less damage that would allow for more time to mess around in the monitor station, we could test your time-saving trick out.
---
~Metroid Prime Tricks~
http://membres.lycos.fr/zell99/metroid
From: shadowptnp | Posted: 2/19/2003 1:01:00 AM
Never mind, I found it. I won't be using it till I get the grappling hook, at least in terms of upgrades ('cause I'm afraid of messing up my 100% game and all...)
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Samus and Zelda, sitting in a tree, K-I-S-S-I-N-G.
Jesus just beat a Metroid?! Wow, guess I chose the right religion. -wasabimilkshake
From: Suikunrules | Posted: 2/19/2003 5:37:17 AM
Wish I had something to contribute. I guess that my Observatory glitch doesn't have major ramifications, so my fifteen minutes of fame has ended =P.

Well, I can wish you guys good luck in Magmoor!

Good luck, and may you someday... uh... get through it! O_o

---
"im blow drying it" - RabidSheep, on SC:BW, in reference to trying cleaning his mouse with some water (See quote)
From: Amasawa | Posted: 2/19/2003 7:04:24 AM
Hey Gold Leader, what did I win? ;-)

Here's a few things about making a 24% run that you may wanna think about:

- Plan on spending a few days getting through the suntower without super missiles (unless you have the luxury of game sessions that last more than half a day :-]) Youkai Sesshoumaru suggested 5 hours and as it turned out, that's about how much total playing time it took me over the course of three days to get it right. Granted, it might not take you anywhere near that long, but don't get discouraged if you wind up spending a lot of time with it. It's a difficult trick to pull off, imo.

- Take your time and save often the first time through it. If one route works better for you than another, go for it and don't worry about the absolute shortest path. For example, going through Twin Fires toward the plasma beam in the geo core with no spider ball and only 99 energy is pretty much a one-shot deal -- if you miss the bomb jump out of the lava, you're toast (pardon the pun) and have to start again at the nearest save point (the ship). If you have trouble with this/don't think it's your idea of a good time, go around through the research labs instead, and walk carefully around the super missile when you get to the top of the observatory.

- Pushing against walls/surfaces underwater gives Samus tremendous height with her jumps. You can actually jump up on top of the wrecked elevator in the crashed frigate with only ONE jump if you find just the right spot and the length of time to spend pushing against the blue stuff in the corner before you pull away. Same for lifegiver; one jump is all it takes to leap out of the water if you use the wall in front of you to your best advantage. The space jump helps, but it's not necessary, so there's a lot of wiggle room for underwater jumps that you need to make; none of them require as much precision as getting the space jump early, for example.

- Don't fight any battles in the mines that you don't have to. Get rid of those damned wave troopers that you meet for the first time and every single battle with pirates after that can be made easier or skipped altogether until you reach Omega. I recall Sesshoumaru saying how that first battle with wave troopers was so difficult that afterwards, he trekked back to the nearest save point. When he returned, the room was filled with wave troopers AND ice... but the doors no longer locked, so he rolled on through. Trebor just mentioned that he found a way to climb to the second floor of the room w/ the mining cannon that won't trigger those two wave troopers to come after you. You can quickly roll past the beam troopers in Ore Processing and activate the spider ball column to the second floor so that you can head up there and use it for some cover while picking 'em off one at a time by taking potshots at 'em over the edge of the floor you're standing on.

I'll pick up on this a little later.
---
Metroid Prime Discoveries
http://membres.lycos.fr/zell99/metroid
From: Gold Leader | Posted: 2/19/2003 7:29:02 AM
you get a cookie :) (It is cheap, I know)

*hands Amasawa a cookie*
---
Todays board hero is: Amasawa.Found on the Metroid Prime board. If this is you, come claim your prize at board: 19931
From: Gold Leader | Posted: 2/19/2003 7:32:12 AM
Thanks, iam going to start after school. (I hate 12 grade!!, stupid advance calulus.:(
---
Todays board hero is: Amasawa.Found on the Metroid Prime board. If this is you, come claim your prize at board: 19931
From: funkytoad | Posted: 2/19/2003 7:38:09 AM
Rofl, advanced calculus is cake ;p
---
ABICDEAFGHMIJKSLMNAOPQTRSTAUVWNXYZ
http://www.dallasmac.com/acc/catalog.php?user=137
From: Gold Leader | Posted: 2/19/2003 7:52:03 AM
lol, your joking.... right? :)
---
Todays board hero is: Amasawa.Found on the Metroid Prime board. If this is you, come claim your prize at board: 19931
From: Amasawa | Posted: 2/19/2003 8:29:43 AM
sweeeeeeet </ eric cartman voice> *accepts cookie

I actually got tossed into calc somehow in high school, even though I hate math. Stuck with it anyway and it turned out to be one of the few smart things I ever did, since it saved me from having to take any math in college, ever.

anyway, one other thing about the 24% run:

- Using power bombs on OP was the extra edge I needed to win that fight w/o charge beam. rolled up to the edge of the phazon and jumped with one regular bomb (the height puts Samus a little closer to OP's weak spot), then placed a power bomb in midair, rolled away slightly, morphed out and switched to x-ray in time for OP to take a beating (Thanks for testing out pbombs on him, funkytoad =]) Most of the time I focused on taking out as many of the pirates as possible and not attacking OP so that I could 'break even' every round as much as possible 'til I got a round of plasma troopers. Since plasma troopers can be killed early w/o charge beam fairly easily, that gave me an opening to power bomb. After two of those, he had so little health left that I just ignored the troopers and blasted him w a few plasma to finish him off.
---
Metroid Prime Discoveries
http://membres.lycos.fr/zell99/metroid
From: Videogaming | Posted: 2/19/2003 12:28:58 PM
How come us videogamers are so good at math? I will go into Calculus next year as a junior...
From: Slio9 | Posted: 2/19/2003 1:17:58 PM
I would like to say a few thing I hope someone reads.

1:I have started 2 new games. 1 for Varia-less Magmoor and the other for 24%. Any tips?

2:I'm making good progress on both. I can walk in the Monitor Station door before dying in Varia-less. In 24% game, I am at the Wave Beam fight.

3:Has any1 made it to Transport Tunnel A in Magmoor? If so,how did you?

4:Good Luck to all trying both of these challenges. Trust me, you WILL need it.

Slio9, Out
---
My favorite things
Cat's, Total Defence Shogun, Pizza, Megaman.EXE,
From: RockMFR 5 | Posted: 2/19/2003 3:04:40 PM
Yeah. Why are we gamers so smart? I'm in Calculus right now (as a junior). Mayve it's because we are all nerds... No, it can't be that, can it? ^_^

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From: CodeMaster13 | Posted: 2/19/2003 3:17:42 PM
I may not be an awesome video gamer, but I am nevertheless a video gamer. I play all of the time, and I am smart too. I am in 3 honors classes as a freshman (High School... grr.... I hate being young), and I should have been in a 4th (damn teacher didn't let me take it...).
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Favorite Games: GTA: Vice City, Metroid Prime, Mario Sunshine, and TLO Zelda: Ocarina of Time
From: theBlackChocobo | Posted: 2/19/2003 4:21:12 PM
I skipped a grade...
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Everyone is Unique.
From: Amasawa | Posted: 2/19/2003 4:43:16 PM
Why are we gamers so smart?

I dunno if I'd go so far as to make that all-inclusive. I've done some pretty dumb things, and somehow I got this funny feeling that I've still got plenty of dumb things left to do. ;^_^

Ragnarok72 -- yeah, I think I know what you're referring to. I don't think I'm cut out for the whole Magmoor no-varia-run thingy but hopefully that advice will come in handy to the brave soul that makes it that far someday.

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Metroid Prime Discoveries
http://membres.lycos.fr/zell99/metroid
From: Gold Leader | Posted: 2/19/2003 4:50:17 PM
hey can someone post nlt th items I need for a 24% game
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Todays board hero is: Amasawa.Found on the Metroid Prime board. If this is you, come claim your prize at board: 19931
From: Gold Leader | Posted: 2/19/2003 4:50:42 PM
*only
*the
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Todays board hero is: Amasawa.Found on the Metroid Prime board. If this is you, come claim your prize at board: 19931
From: Amasawa | Posted: 2/19/2003 4:57:01 PM
see the 24% game section at zell's site
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Metroid Prime Discoveries
http://membres.lycos.fr/zell99/metroid
From: Snoopdigger XP | Posted: 2/19/2003 6:03:20 PM
Unfortunately, I have not made it as far as the Transport Tunnel A, but I think I have found a way to save 10+ seconds in fiery shores, but it's tricky. You see, you have to cut corners on the path above the lava. Although I keep falling in...

Anyway I made a mathematical breakthrough. You lose health NO FASTER IN THE ROOT CAVE ENTRANCE THAN IN THE CHOZO RUINS ENTRANCE!!! Thus, DO THE ROOT CAVE ENTRANCE!!!

Oh yeah, about the pbomb thingy when you die, I was able to move around while it was going off. Strange?!
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I am the Master, version XP.
<|0|> <|0|>
From: funkytoad | Posted: 2/19/2003 7:28:04 PM
TheBlackChocobo:I skipped a grade too ;p
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From: theBlackChocobo | Posted: 2/19/2003 7:54:26 PM
well la-de-dah, funky ;)
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Everyone is Unique.
From: Mario Cleanstuff | Posted: 2/19/2003 7:56:56 PM
I was given a chance to skip 2, but didn't. I stayed in the same grade to stay with my friends.

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"I tend to procrastinate, and sometimes I even put that off." -Me "BOOMP! thiaes toppick needseses two stae alyve!"-Me on the MP board
HOO-AH! 62
From: Videogaming | Posted: 2/19/2003 7:57:20 PM
I would have, except my principal in elementary school wouldn't let ANYBODY skip. Go figure.
From: montypylon10189 | Posted: 2/19/2003 8:46:02 PM
Lol! i skipped a grade too. Oh, and for the varia-less Megmoor ppl, just go in there and stand in a hot room and use a stopwatch to time how long you live so that youll know how fast you have to be.
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Metroid Prime- Hard-100%, Hard-24%, Normal 2:21 SMS-117 shines SFA-99% SSBM- 287trophies SA2:B- 175 emblems MLB Slugfest 2003- Allstar season 52-0
From: l2ag3 | Posted: 2/19/2003 8:48:56 PM
different rooms deplete your health at different rates
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From: Mario Cleanstuff | Posted: 2/19/2003 9:40:35 PM
bump of doom!

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"I tend to procrastinate, and sometimes I even put that off." -Me "BOOMP! thiaes toppick needseses two stae alyve!"-Me on the MP board
HOO-AH! 62
From: Suikunrules | Posted: 2/20/2003 5:19:39 AM
Wow, all these grade-skippers...

Like Videogaming, I probably would have skipped, but all the schools I've been to seem to hate the idea. I probably wouldn't have accepted if given the choice, though; everyone from the New York educational system to my teachers think I'm a miniature Einstein except me. My opinion of myself is something like "waste of oxygen". =P

On-Topic: *insert cheering for Varia-less Magmoor people here*

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"im blow drying it" - RabidSheep, on SC:BW, in reference to trying cleaning his mouse with some water (See quote)
From: CALFoolio | Posted: 2/20/2003 10:13:58 AM
hey, i was held back 5 years in kindergarten XD

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http://www.ocf.berkeley.edu/~henhen/ssbm/
BtT: 3:35.87 HRC: 86644.8 ft
From: tlj9204 | Posted: 2/20/2003 11:04:56 AM
Regarding Ragnarok and Banks' messages about that Space Jump trick (saving about three seconds); it does work since the one time I made it just inside Transport Tunnel A (and immediately died since it's a super hot room), I Space Jumped from the middle, right above the Turret. And yes, if you jump up the platforms fast enough, the Turret won't have time to target you while you Space Jump over to the bridge. It actually would save about five seconds since you don't have to deal with the two Puffers near your location. If I could get up there again, I'd test it out, but as it is now, I keep getting killed by the third Turret upon entering the room (I get midway across the center platform before succumbing).

-Tim
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IRC channel: #MetroidPrime
Prime Discoveries: http://membres.lycos.fr/zell99/metroid
From: zell99 | Posted: 2/20/2003 3:09:10 PM
when you get under that 3rd turret, jump over the railing to cut the corner instead of going into the structure.. you'll land directly on the bridge going to the morph ball tunnel.. here's a little ASCII.. it sucks but meh.. ;)

............* center structure, with computers
P*********
P****o****..********
.........o..*TT*
............*o.********
............*o*********
.............o
.............o
.............o
............small platforms

.

.

********** = walls
..... = ignore them
P = phendrana's elevator
T = the 3th turret
o = the path you take (mainly in the air)

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http://membres.lycos.fr/zell99/metroid
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From: Snoopdigger XP | Posted: 2/20/2003 7:30:44 PM
I had a chance to skip as well, but I decided to stay w/ my friends.

ON TOPIC: Different rooms don't deplete your heath faster. If you keep an eye on your health gauge, you will see that at different times your health goes faster w/o you moving. Look at the crummy ASCII drawing of what I think it looks like.

399 299 199 99 1
________ _______
---------------/ \ / \
--- \-------------/ \--

Don't laugh; it's the best I can do. Oh well, I guess that it equals out to 9.9999999... seconds for an energy tank, so I can round that to 10. 40 seconds. I have 56.
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Proud participant in the Varia-less Magmoor run!
Current time: 56 seconds
From: Banks17 | Posted: 2/20/2003 7:47:06 PM
Are you saying that the less life you have, the faster it depletes? This may make sense, as opposed to the further you get, the faster it depletes. Maybe if you were able to keep your hp at a constant level throughout the run, it could buy you a few-many extra seconds?
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~Metroid Prime Tricks~
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From: PsYcHoSoUl | Posted: 2/20/2003 8:35:19 PM
i skipped a grade too! And I thought i was alone all thoses days.... oh well that's off topic so i'll **** up
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Asking what is the best ? Stop here!
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From: Snoopdigger XP | Posted: 2/20/2003 9:12:52 PM
I made a completely hypothetical text document describing what to do in this Magmoor run. Anybody want to see?
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Proud participant in the Varia-less Magmoor run!
Current time: 56 seconds
From: Paratroopa1 | Posted: 2/20/2003 9:23:52 PM
Actually, I don't think it's the lower health you have, but rather how long you are in the danger zone. I think you should test this out. The reason I think this is because I made this observation with phazon. When you jump in phazon for about one fourth of a second, you can avoid damage completely. However, if you stay put for several seconds in the phazon, notice that the damage starts to get HUGE and starts increasing exponentially. But then jump out and back in and it starts out very little again, even though you're at considerably less health.

I think the damage does eventually cap out, though.

This is only my theory, it may only apply to phazon, but I think you should check that out. It might not be much, but we'll need every little piece of knowledge we can get, huh? :|
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"I gets soooooooooooooo annoying!" ~ BlueWizard13
"I love to hear people praise me so please feel free to tell me how good I am." ~ jibtothemax
From: keybladeswordsman | Posted: 2/20/2003 10:01:14 PM
tlj9 and Snoop, let me see your data. Varia-less magmoor is almost in our grasp.

*tries to reach phend. elevator but slips and dies*
From: jamescom1 | Posted: 2/20/2003 11:38:28 PM
Yeah, I noticed the same thing as Paratroopa1 for phazon and also, I think, for Magmoor.
From: Paratroopa1 | Posted: 2/21/2003 2:12:36 AM
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.

OMG.

The Tower of Light likes me or something.

First Artifact of Lifegiver w/o Gravity Suit.

Now...

ARTIFACT OF LIFEGIVER W/O GRAVITY SUIT AND SPACE JUMP!
(I hope nobody's found this yet. ;\)

ENTIRELY on accident, I managed to get up to the Artifact of Lifegiver w/o BOTH Gravity Suit AND Space Jump. And it's so incredibly easy to do, it makes getting it without Grav easier, too.

All you need to do is hug the front wall that leads up to the ledge with the Wave Beam door, underwater in the Tower of Light. Do a single jump, and keep hugging the wall. Samus SKYROCKETS UP THAT ****ING LEDGE. It's some kind of glitch with the wall or something. Very bizarre.

There is one problem but I got around it. The ledge juts out just enough so that if you keep hugging the wall, you'll get stopped. You just need to pull back slightly about midway up the jump, and then push forward to get on the ledge.

Heh, I was just trying stuff trying to get Lifegiver without Grav for the fun of it, and I figured this out by a total fluke. How fun. :D

Ama's doing a no-SJ run, right? Boy, if he doesn't know about this one yet... :)

Anyway, I officially declare myself THE KING OF THE LIFEGIVER ARTIFACT. Bow down to me, for I like to discover things completely on accident! BOW DOWN TO ME NOW, FOOLS! >:D
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"I gets soooooooooooooo annoying!" ~ BlueWizard13
"I love to hear people praise me so please feel free to tell me how good I am." ~ jibtothemax
From: Paratroopa1 | Posted: 2/21/2003 2:17:48 AM
Oh yes, make sure you lock your view up when doing the jump, too.
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"I gets soooooooooooooo annoying!" ~ BlueWizard13
"I love to hear people praise me so please feel free to tell me how good I am." ~ jibtothemax
From: CALFoolio | Posted: 2/21/2003 2:41:08 AM
sorry paratroopa, but that's old news. amasawa already did it for his 24% run which is withouta grav suit.

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http://www.ocf.berkeley.edu/~henhen/ssbm/
BtT: 3:35.87 HRC: 86712.4 ft
From: Paratroopa1 | Posted: 2/21/2003 3:01:20 AM
A) You realize I am talking about Lifegiver w/o Space Jump AND Grav Suit, right? Not just one or the other, but both?

B) If so, how are you absolutely positive? I keep really close tabs on what's going on in this, so I'd be amazed if I hadn't heard of it yet.

C) I discovered Lifegiver w/o Grav, not Amasawa. So it's not "old news" if I discovered it, silly. =P
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"I gets soooooooooooooo annoying!" ~ BlueWizard13
"I love to hear people praise me so please feel free to tell me how good I am." ~ jibtothemax
From: kip | Posted: 2/21/2003 4:13:28 AM
i just noticed something amasawa said earlier, but i'll add bold to one part:

"- Pushing against walls/surfaces underwater gives Samus tremendous height with her jumps. You can actually jump up on top of the wrecked elevator in the crashed frigate with only ONE jump if you find just the right spot and the length of time to spend pushing against the blue stuff in the corner before you pull away. Same for lifegiver; one jump is all it takes to leap out of the water if you use the wall in front of you to your best advantage. The space jump helps, but it's not necessary, so there's a lot of wiggle room for underwater jumps that you need to make; none of them require as much precision as getting the space jump early, for example."

so i guess he did know already. btw man, are there any trouble spots you encountered in the no sj game? where are you at? i'm assuming you'll get grapple beam and other stuff to make life easier and see if sj can be skipped at all, before any thought is put toward working it out so that the methods don't depend on other items and the % can be lowered again.
From: Snoopdigger XP | Posted: 2/21/2003 9:00:17 AM
My hypothetical text document:
-
go to your ship. SAVE. Go to the Root Cave and head down to Magmoor Caverns. Turn right and open the door. DON’T DO THROUGH IT! Go into morph ball. Get ready, because this is where the fun begins.

You have about 2 seconds before the heat kicks in, so head to the right. Go up the ramp and go along the tracks. When you get off, roll over to the door. Place a bomb. Morph out, and the door will open. Hold A to start charging your beam. Go through the door. As soon as you are through the door, blast the crates on the left-hand side of you. Roll into morph ball mode and make your way to the top of your bomb ladder. You are now reaching the part where everyone shaves off their time.

On this huge morph ball track, roll as fast as you can, and cut the corners. If you fall into the lava, don’t bother going on. About 3/4 of the way, it’s time to pull a desperate trick. Roll through a gap in the tracks toward the platform with the Triclops on it. Morph out and try not to hit the stupid thing.

Go along the correct path until you come to the point where you no longer have you jump. Roll into morph ball and go under the flame jets. The Shore Tunnel shouldn’t pose a problem, so race through that. You will get into the Monitor Station.

Blast the crates and run to the energy. Now, run toward the middle of the station. Do a double-jump while using the rapid-fire missile technique on the turrets. Once you are in the middle, shoots the crates and the far turret. Run to the door. You are now inside transport tunnel A. If you have 80+ energy left, you should do okay. Oh yeah, DON’T GO FOR THE ENERGY TANK!!! The elevator is a cold room, so you won’t take damage.

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Proud participant in the Varia-less Magmoor run!
Current time: 56 seconds
From: Paratroopa1 | Posted: 2/21/2003 2:55:09 PM
Dang, so Ama already did Lifegiver w/o SJ and Grav? Well, damnit. >_< Ah well, I thought it was cool. And I discovered it completely on my own nontheless. So nyah.
:P

I looked at getting Wavebuster w/o SJ, but I couldn't do it. I think you might be able to do with with some expert tbjms, but I couldn't quite make it. So it doesn't look terribly hopeful, but then again, it's not worth anything anyway. :P

I'm still going to have to try Metroid Quarantine A without Spider Ball, though. I think this new theory might work. I'll do it when I get home (I'm on a school computer right now :\).
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"I gets soooooooooooooo annoying!" ~ BlueWizard13
"I love to hear people praise me so please feel free to tell me how good I am." ~ jibtothemax
From: Snoopdigger XP | Posted: 2/21/2003 5:10:47 PM
Page two alert!
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Proud participant in the Varia-less Magmoor run!
Current time: 56 seconds
From: Snoopdigger XP | Posted: 2/21/2003 9:23:57 PM
This topic is dead.
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Proud participant in the Varia-less Magmoor run!
Current time: 56 seconds
From: RockMFR 5 | Posted: 2/21/2003 9:52:46 PM
How close are we to a Varia-less Magmoor? Has anyone even got close to getting through the Monitor Station yet?

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From: l2ag3 | Posted: 2/21/2003 10:15:35 PM
the topics dead cause we talk about this kind of stuff on the IRC channel
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From: hpsolo | Posted: 2/22/2003 2:59:25 AM
Some comments about getting the Ice Beam early. According to

http://membres.lycos.fr/zell99/metroid/icebeam.html

you can optionally use the L-lock feature with the space jumping method. I think the explanation isn't entirely correct. What you have to do is look down, and THEN get as close as you can to the magnetic tracks (facing the correct way, of course). That is, you MUST look down and MUST let your view return to normal during your jumps. The reason is because when your view springs back to the normal position, your gun actually protrudes from your body much more so than when you're looking down. So when you've jumped up and your view has sprung back, what's keeping you from falling is some bad clipping action by the game engine. That is, the gun is in a sense stabbing through the surface and hence getting you "caught."

Quakeworld players know that this is the same thing that happens in areas where walls meet. A prime example is on DM3 outside where the Pentagram of Protection appears.

On a slightly different note, I was able to get up to the morph slot without even jumping. I believe the sequence was simply starting out with looking down, release the view so it sprung back to normal and repeating this pattern. Unfortunately I haven't been able to duplicate this often, so I'm not sure if that is indeed what you have to do.

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Cheers,
hpsolo (Metroid Speed Runs @ http://www.classicgaming.com/msr)
From: CALFoolio | Posted: 2/22/2003 4:07:30 AM
wow, i never noticed this. i beat op without the grav suit for the first time today, and i noticed that in the cut-scene where op dies and infuses samus's suit with phazon, she comes out with the grav suit instead of the phazon suit. aside from in the cut scene, she has the phazon suit on everywhere else.

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BtT: 3:35.87 HRC: 86712.4 ft
From: Snoopdigger XP | Posted: 2/22/2003 10:02:29 AM
Unfortunately, I don't have IRC or whatever that is. So I have to talk about everything here.

Did you like my document?
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Proud participant in the Varia-less Magmoor run!
Current time: 56 seconds
From: CodeMaster13 | Posted: 2/22/2003 10:58:07 AM
Good job Snoopdigger. It sounds like it can work.
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From: Snoopdigger XP | Posted: 2/22/2003 5:28:10 PM
It sounds like it can work because it really can. And not by just running your ass off. *Shameless flaming of Wu*
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Proud participant in the Varia-less Magmoor run!
Current time: 56 seconds
From: Mario Cleanstuff | Posted: 2/22/2003 9:01:29 PM
Why is this topic on page 2?

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HOO-AH! 62
From: keybladeswordsman | Posted: 2/22/2003 10:17:44 PM
Snoop, I assume you had made it to phendrana. Am I correct or you just posted that document for people to get through to phendrana?
From: Ragnarok72 | Posted: 2/22/2003 10:25:41 PM
>Regarding Ragnarok and Banks' messages about that Space Jump trick (saving about three seconds); it does work since the one time I made it just inside Transport Tunnel A (and immediately died since it's a super hot room), I Space Jumped from the middle, right above the Turret. And yes, if you jump up the platforms fast enough, the Turret won't have time to target you while you Space Jump over to the bridge. It actually would save about five seconds since you don't have to deal with the two Puffers near your location.

tlj9204, you just made my day. I actually contributed something of value to the Magmoor run! YAY! :p

Oh, and in other news, I think we need to modify some information on the second method of getting the Ice beam early.

First off, the clipping bug being exploited in that method has a side effect of making you go up by just pushing against the track as described on the site, you really don't need to jump much at all. If you see the yellow lines of the track moving around when pushing against it, you're moving up, without jumping....strange, eh?

And no, I haven't gotten early Space Jump yet, grr. I'm trying both methods and it isn't working; especially the dbjm from the Gunship. I guess I'm stumped on how to get enough momentum to do it....
From: Snoopdigger XP | Posted: 2/23/2003 10:33:56 AM
Keybladeswordsman, you give me too much credit. I have made it almost halfway through Transport Tunnel A. But it IS possible. If I can shave off 5 seconds, I would have it!
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Proud participant in the Varia-less Magmoor run!
Current time: 52 seconds
From: Ragnarok72 | Posted: 2/23/2003 10:46:48 AM
Hey, Snoopdogger, I found that extra five seconds you're looking for. Of course I'll need to repeat the previous quote, and bold what I'm talking about:

>Regarding Ragnarok and Banks' messages about that Space Jump trick (saving about three seconds); it does work since the one time I made it just inside Transport Tunnel A (and immediately died since it's a super hot room), I Space Jumped from the middle, right above the Turret. And yes, if you jump up the platforms fast enough, the Turret won't have time to target you while you Space Jump over to the bridge. It actually would save about five seconds since you don't have to deal with the two Puffers near your location.
From: Snoopdigger XP | Posted: 2/23/2003 10:51:46 AM
I already do that. But thanks anyway. I am trying to shave off seconds in the feiry shores.
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Proud participant in the Varia-less Magmoor run!
Current time: 52 seconds
From: Videogaming | Posted: 2/23/2003 11:16:17 AM
I was fooling around in the Ruined Shrine...

NEW way to get Wavebuster before Spider Ball!

You need the boost and space jump. Boost up to the right ledge. (To Samus' right when you first come in the room.) Then, L-lock space jump to the ledge with the wave beam door. You have to do your second jump a bit late so that you clear the bump in the spider track. I think this method is easier...
From: Snoopdigger XP | Posted: 2/23/2003 3:19:03 PM
Power Bump
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Proud participant in the Varia-less Magmoor run!
Current time: 52 seconds
From: Vidgamer5887 | Posted: 2/23/2003 3:25:38 PM
I've been trying to do the Magmoor Run without Varia but the Turrets in the monitor station keep killing me. Do you guys kill the puffers in the other rooms or just run by them? I try to kill them when they are out of the way and draw in the pickups. I also can't pull off the get the space jump early trick.

Even if we get to Phendrana and it doesn't dmg us we have to come back to magmoor multiple times for artifacts and plasma and such. Will this really work?
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9 out of 10 people agree that 1 out of every 10 people can't agree with the other 9.
From: Snoopdigger XP | Posted: 2/23/2003 7:49:25 PM
Don't worry, it will be worth it. IF PDA DOESN'T KILL US, then there is several energy tanks we can get. We just have to cut our time!
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Proud participant in the Varia-less Magmoor run!
Current time: 52 seconds
From: Ragnarok72 | Posted: 2/24/2003 10:47:15 AM
BUMP.....

Come on, people! Varia-less Magmoor is nearly in our grasp! All we need is just 5 more seconds! This needs to be bumped, if not for great justice......

:p
From: Lord Skeletor | Posted: 2/24/2003 10:50:40 AM
Hey guys, check this out. Me and kip have been working on ways to make the power bomb run easier for a 24 percent game and get this.

Elite Control, which is the room after ore processing.

Know how there's a million ice troopers at the top you gotta try to run around or deal with?

Well you don't gotta deal with 'em

After you beat the Elite Pirate and the forcefields open, just go back the way you came to the elevator room

Then go back AGAIN to Elite Control

The room will refresh. And when it refreshes, no ice troopers. Nope, shadow pirates. That's it. SHADOWS. and of course that's nothing to our early plasma beam :P

I had the idea of trying this for ore processing, going in and going back to refresh it to make the power troopers go away but it didn't work. Then kip had the notion of trying it in Elite control so I did and it's awesome. No troopers to deal with there now.

Since Trebor's trick makes elite research such a breeze and amasawa's trick for running through ore processing seems to work pretty well

It appears the only REAL room of ANY concern now is the first room with the 3 waves. And remember, you can save after beating the 3 waves once and the room becomes easier because you can just run all through it :P

---
Shield Eaters and World Leaders have many likes alike
From: SpoonMan | Posted: 2/24/2003 11:23:44 AM
so I'm new to the board but this sounds like a real challenge, so ima gunna try but one quick question how does the 24% add up i mean there is 12 artifacts plus all this
1. missle launcher
2. wave beam
3. ice beam
4. plasma beam
5. morph ball
6. morph ball bombs
7. boost ball
8. spider ball
9. power bombs
10. space jump boots
11. x-ray visor
12. varia suit
13. phazon suit
14. phazon beam

doesnt that add up to 26?
From: CALFoolio | Posted: 2/24/2003 11:33:32 AM
i have a slight variation for the varia-less magmoor run:

first off, it requires early space jump and 3 energy tanks.

like snoopdigger's strat, you must start off saved at samus's ship, head down the root cave, and then transport to magmoor.

the first room (transport tunnel b) is the same as in snoopdigger's strat. you can barely make it past the magmoor before it starts breathing fire. make sure to lay the bomb a bit before you reach the door, because it has a slight detonation range.

once, you enter the fiery shores, the flame jets should be shooting fire down. keep running while hugging the left wall. jump into the lava and quickly jump back out of it while holding a charge beam. the flame jets should barely stop when u jump in and if you jump out of the lava fast enough, you won't take more than a few damage. then jump onto the rock area before the big lava pit.

break the 2 boxes to the left and hopefully collect some health. do a long jump towards the small island to the left with the triclops. hold a charge shot and make sure to avoid the annoying magmoor. then space jump towards the island with the boxes right before you're about to hit the lava. shoot the charge shot on the ascent of your jump to break the boxes too. you'll land in the lava and sink a little. double jump out and collect the health from the boxes. if you're fast enough, you shouldn't lose more than 20 health from the lava.

20 health is roughly equivalent to 2 seconds of heat damage. imo, the 2 seconds is easily saved by not having to do the bomb jumps up the ladder and taking the awkwardly long route to the island with the triclops.

if you're fast enough, the 2nd set of flame jets will be inactive and you'll barely be able to clear them before they shoot fire again. shoot the door before you reach it so that it opens early, then morph into a ball, and roll thru the shore tunnel.

morph out of the ball a bit before you reach the monitor station door and shoot the door. there'll be a 1 second delay before it opens, but it should give u enough time to ready a charge shot.

when the door opens, shoot the boxes at the top of the ramp near the turrets. then use the fast fire missiles to break the 2 nearest turrets. collect the health (there shouldn't be any missiles) and then race for the round platform. listen to the other turret so that you know when to jump over its shots.

single jump onto the round platform, and then double jump onto the higher ledge while holding a charge. then double jump up 2 ledges while turning left. shoot the turret with the charge shot and then release a missile to destroy it. then do a full space jump to the suspended walkway. try to shoot the door to transport tunnel a when you land. morph into a ball and roll to the door. it should open befor eyou get there allowing you to enter transport tunnel a without losing speed.

the rest is basically the same. my best run was 60-65 seconds, but i had the varia suit, so i'm not sure if i woulda have made it. if i ever manage to get the early space jump, i'm gonna do it for realz XD

---
http://www.ocf.berkeley.edu/~henhen/ssbm/
BtT: 3:35.87 HRC: 86712.4 ft
From: Amasawa | Posted: 2/24/2003 11:37:42 AM
spoonman: check site in my sig

para-- yeah, did know about that but good find anyway. Get going on figuring out that stuff for the rest of the game and help me w/ this no space jump thing.

kip -- still stuck in no space jump game on getting out of phazon mines somehow from power bombs. I can get as far as the wrecked frigate, or phazon processing center, but I can't get back through the frigate, or cross the platforms above the water on lower half of Great Tree Hall, or up to the very top of the processing center w no space jump (I can get within 2-3 platforms of the top, and can climb all the way up from the bottom if I fall down, but that's about it). Will fill you in w/more details when I get back if you want.

skeletor: you and kip are nuts (I mean that in a nice way) if you are trying 24% hard run w/o reloading the rooms) =). I agree; only really necessary tough battle before OP was first battle w/ wave troopers. Everything else is either somewhat workaround-able or not particularly difficult until OP.

trebor: I tried your trick in the room w/ mining cannon night before I left but every time I jumped on top of the pipe the wave pirates triggered. =( Couldn't figure out what I was doing wrong. Will have to ask you more about it sometime

---
Metroid Prime Discoveries
http://membres.lycos.fr/zell99/metroid
From: SolrFlare | Posted: 2/24/2003 4:07:12 PM
In regards to the question up above as to how it equals 24% its because the phazon suit/beam for some reason are never added to your total completion percentage unless you have collected every other item in the game. Also the Phazon Suit/Beam are then only counted as 1 single item.

So unless oyou ahve collected every missle expansion, energy tank, etc, phzon doesn't count. Thats why if you've collected every single item but 1 when trying to get 100% it says "98%" instead of 99%. Once you collect the last item, the Phazon suit finally gets added to the percentage and blam 100% game.
---
Solr_Flare
From: Snoopdigger XP | Posted: 2/24/2003 5:34:54 PM
I am getting so ****ing close but not quite there you. Has anyone else made it into Transport Tunnel A yet?
---
Proud participant in the Varia-less Magmoor run!
Current time: 52 seconds
From: Ragnarok72 | Posted: 2/24/2003 6:06:55 PM
Hey, when Varia-Less Magmoor is accomplished and a strat is put up on the Metroid Prime Tricks site, am I going to recieve any credit for coming up with that Monitor-Station-Space-Jump-to-2nd-Level-Catwalk Shortcut trick?

And, to inject a bit of humour to all you who are frustrated with Varia-Less Magmoor, I've come up with the beginning of a parody of an oft-quoted Bible verse used in times of trouble:

"And though I run through the Shadows of the Caverns of Magmoor, I shall fear no flame; for my wits are with me, my Morph Ball and Space Jump Boots, they comfort me..."

...and that's all I got. Those of you familiar with Psalm 29 (the section from which I was parody-ing) who are so inclined to come up with more, feel free to do so. This is mainly to be used as a humourous stress-reliever.
From: Ragnarok72 | Posted: 2/24/2003 6:13:32 PM
On second thought, I think it would be better if "shall fear no flame" be changed to "shall not panic".

Meaning, it'll read like:

"And though I run through the Shadows of the Caverns of Magmoor, I shall not panic; for my wits are with me, my Morph Ball and Space Jump Boots, they comfort me..."

Oh, and also, I just came up with something to parody the first verse of that section, to have it relate more to what we're doing:

"The Varia has big shoulders, I shall not want it..."
From: funkytoad | Posted: 2/24/2003 6:56:46 PM
Hey, when Varia-Less Magmoor is accomplished and a strat is put up on the Metroid Prime Tricks site, am I going to recieve any credit for coming up with that Monitor-Station-Space-Jump-to-2nd-Level-Catwalk Shortcut trick?


Might as well give me, and every other half intelligent MP player credit for it as well. I mean really, it's SO easy to figure out, I cannot believe you're trying to take sole credit for it -_-;
---
ABICDEAFGHMIJKSLMNAOPQTRSTAUVWNXYZ
http://www.dallasmac.com/acc/catalog.php?user=137
From: montypylon10189 | Posted: 2/24/2003 7:23:31 PM
I am sooooo ****ing pissed at this game and its ****ing loading times. i made it to the door in transport tunnel A with about 30 health left, because almost every puffer i shot dropped energy. i shot the door AND THE GOD DAMN MOTHER ****ING PIECE OF **** LOADING TIME WAS APPROX. 4 SECS AND I DIED RIGHT AS THE DOOR OPENED! Grrrrrrrrrrrrrrr! ill bet the transport room doesnt hurt you either since there's no lava.
---
Metroid Prime- Hard-100%, Hard-24%, Normal 2:21 SMS-117 shines SFA-99% SSBM- 287trophies SA2:B- 175 emblems MLB Slugfest 2003- Allstar season 52-0
From: Ragnarok72 | Posted: 2/24/2003 7:28:51 PM
>Might as well give me, and every other half intelligent MP player credit for it as well. I mean really, it's SO easy to figure out, I cannot believe you're trying to take sole credit for it-_-

*slaps own forehead*

You've got a point there. Boy, do I feel kinda dumb.

Bah, maybe I should work on completely parodying that Bible verse or something. At least that's kinda original, if not completely silly.
From: Ragnarok72 | Posted: 2/24/2003 8:00:51 PM
>THE GOD DAMN MOTHER ****ING PIECE OF **** LOADING TIME WAS APPROX. 4 SECS AND I DIED RIGHT AS THE DOOR OPENED! Grrrrrrrrrrrrrrr!

For all we know, the game probably did that on purpose.

Oh, and you know how in some areas when you come out of morph ball mode it skips the the slow camara transitision?

Perhaps if we were to figure out how to do that at will, we could shave off the time it normally takes for the camara to travel from 3 feet behind you to inside the helmet, if you get what I'm saying.

For what it's worth, my current theory on how to get the the game to trigger "glitch" is to keep mashing the the X button as you're coming out of the tunnel. It seems that if you hit the button the INSTANT (and I mean INSTANT, like split-second timing) the game restores the X button's morph ball switching functionality, it does it.
From: Paratroopa1 | Posted: 2/24/2003 8:05:21 PM
Yeah, if the Varialess Magmoor run is accomplished, I think the people who should get credit for it should be the first person to do it and show proof or at least a reproducable strategy (or at least someone who's reliable), and anyone who makes a really groundbreaking discovery (i.e. standing on your head while singing your nation's anthem makes Samus twice as fast).

Anyway, I'm not sure if I've posted this here yet, but I think I should because I want people to try it out.

Okay, two rooms that have been baffling me for a while

-Main Quarry (going from there directly to Waste Disposal w/o Grapple, could save a lot of time in speed runs and a lot of sanity in 24% runs)

-Metroid Quarantine A (w/o Spider Ball, to get Phazon Suit before Thardus and get one room away from completing the game w/o Spider Ball)

I have an idea that applies to both of these.

Okay, sadly, when you freeze enemies, if you can stand on them, you do not ger your jumps back. Too bad, because it would make Main Quarry -> Waste Disposal a piece of cake. HOWEVER, providing you don't slide off, you CAN do a dbj or even a tbj if you have enough time.

For Main Quarry -> Waste Disposal w/o Grapple, this would probably involve freezing a space pirate near the base of the wall, then quickly tbjm'ing off of it.

For Metroid Quarantine A w/o Spider Ball, it would definately be tricky. You cannot stand on top of a Metroid; they are too small. However, you CAN freeze them in a clump and stand on that clump (I've actually done it AND succeeded in pulling off a tbj from that clump, but I didn't freeze them in the correct position to get up there; it will be very tough to do, if it's possible).

Now, the biggest problem is probably the huge time constraint. An uncharged ice beam shot freeze a Space Pirate for about 3 seconds, and a Metroid for only about 6 (and you have to shoot seven of them). A partially-charged shot freezes them for about x1.5 that amount, and a fully-charged shot I don't know about, since sp's die in one hit from a fully-charged shot, and I haven't tried it on Metroids. There's also positioning to worry about- they must be frozen in a really good place. This means that if these are possible (I personally think these are both very plausible theories), they will be INSANELY difficult to reproduce, most likely.

But that won't stop me. I've tried it a few times, and in both cases, have come somewhat close, so I think someone with better skill than I have might be able to pull it off. Would some people try testing this?
---
"I gets soooooooooooooo annoying!" ~ BlueWizard13
"I love to hear people praise me so please feel free to tell me how good I am." ~ jibtothemax
From: Snoopdigger XP | Posted: 2/24/2003 8:40:45 PM
Did anyone like my hypothetical game document? Just wondering...
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Proud participant in the Varia-less Magmoor run!
Current time: 52 seconds
From: Ragnarok72 | Posted: 2/24/2003 8:43:49 PM
[This message was deleted at the request of the original poster]
From: Ragnarok72 | Posted: 2/24/2003 8:44:37 PM
While posting in the Action Replay thread, a new term of respect occured to me.

Kip, Amasawa, Banks, and any other person who made a breakthrough in getting Items early, I dub thee the Official Metroid Prime "Sequence Breakers".

And yes, I think the term "Sequence Breaker" is sig-able....
From: TreborSelbon | Posted: 2/24/2003 9:43:33 PM
If only I had known about the Elite Control Trick a few days ago...I could've saved a minute or two.

---
Real programmers don't comment their code. If it was hard to write, it should be hard to understand.
From: Mario Cleanstuff | Posted: 2/25/2003 5:37:31 PM
aaaaaaaaaaaand...... WEEEEEEEEEEEEE!

bump

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"I tend to procrastinate, and sometimes I even put that off." -Me "BOOMP! thiaes toppick needseses two stae alyve!"-Me on the MP board
HOO-AH! 62
From: Snoopdigger XP | Posted: 2/25/2003 6:34:19 PM
Everyone who is working on the Varia-less Magmoor run post your time in your sig.
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Proud participant in the Varia-less Magmoor run!
Current time: 52 seconds
From: Snoopdigger XP | Posted: 2/25/2003 7:15:12 PM
[This message was deleted at the request of the original poster]___________________________________________Bump in disguise!
From: darkfox01 | Posted: 2/25/2003 8:40:16 PM
If people are looking for this, BUMP
---
"Knowledge equals power. Power corrupts. Study hard, be evil." "It's amazing how everytime you open your mouth you prove you're an idoit" Vegeta-DBZ
From: Ragnarok72 | Posted: 2/25/2003 8:54:10 PM
"Someone Set Us Up the Bomb Jump!"

....Yes, folks, its another Zero Wing Pun!

So, has anyone tried to see if the skip-the-morph-ball-camara-transition glitch can gain any extra time in the Magmoor run?
From: Icesorcofdeath | Posted: 2/26/2003 10:36:43 AM
BUMP
---
~Shadowbane~ The Renegades site~http://www.geocities.com/therenegadessb/
From: Lord Skeletor | Posted: 2/26/2003 12:49:17 PM
Hey guys, working on Quarry > Waste Disposal and I managed to get on top of the big cylinder that's on top of everything

You know the cylinder I mean right? The crane attatches to the top of it. I triple bomb jump morphed to it from the glass tube that has the computers inside

You know how if you move the crane and get up to the top of the cylinder via magnet track, it won't let you unmorph while you are up there?

Well get this

I triple bomb jumped and unmorphed in the air to end up standing on the cylinder. I was up there unmorphed. For like a second

then it AUTOMATICALLY MORPHED ME. It seems it won't allow anyone up there who is not a ball. And of course I can't UNmorph

ain't that a kick? P.S. there's a weird purple arrow in the middle of the top of that cylinder if anyone cares. It points away from the crane head as if you say "You can't get up there".
---
Shield Eaters and World Leaders have many likes alike
From: Samus aran x | Posted: 2/26/2003 1:29:38 PM
BUMP, im currently working on a way thru metroid quarentine a and i found somthing very perculiar... there's a rock on the wall(you cnat really see it that great) if you jump and turn twards the wall your gun will get "stuck" or hung up on it but it doesn't really help cause you cant jump off once you get stuck -_-;
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(what's good about a clock radio) well you can listen to it, and see exactly what time your listening to.. Im listeing to 11:00 P.M....lol
From: Samus aran x | Posted: 2/26/2003 1:41:26 PM
cant and i ment im workin on a way thru it without the spiderball
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(what's good about a clock radio) well you can listen to it, and see exactly what time your listening to.. Im listeing to 11:00 P.M....lol
From: Silver Striker | Posted: 2/26/2003 1:59:22 PM
well, good luck, you'll need it
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how about your just jelous i got all 100% of the items-Vincent vs alucard
From: Knux Chao | Posted: 2/26/2003 5:34:22 PM
BUMP-a-roni!
---
Proud owner of a Light, Angel, and Devil Chaos Chao!
SADX should be called Sonic Adventure Cubed and you know it.
From: Snoopdigger XP | Posted: 2/26/2003 6:07:16 PM
HELLO?
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Proud participant in the Varia-less Magmoor run!
Current time: 52 seconds
From: Paratroopa1 | Posted: 2/26/2003 8:32:10 PM
I have some good news.

1) Okay, I can pretty much confirm that Main Quarry -> Waste Disposal w/o Grapple is possible. The unfortunate part is that it may only be possible with the Charge Beam, on Hard, and even then it may not be humanly possible. Okay, see, my theory is that you can freeze an sp in Main Quarry, stand on it, morph, and tbj up to the ledge. I have even pulled off a tbj off of one once using a partially-charged shot on Normal (just barely), but I haven't been able to make it up there. I just discovered something on accident. If you freeze a Space Pirate while it is airborne, it will stay in the air. Space Pirates do jump while fighting you, but it's a quick jump so I don't know if you'll be able to freeze them by any means but dumb luck, and then you might not have enough time to get up there. They do not stay frozen long at all, and charged Ice Beam shots on normal kill them (they do not in Hard). It might be possible with Charge, but then it would be useless in a 24% run. Still, if I could pull this off, it would be BIG. I'm still trying this same thing with Metroid Quaratine A as well. Damn, I really want to pull this off.

2) Listen up, Magmoor w/o Varia people: I have discovered a method for morphing out of Morph Ball mode and skipping the animation. Bad news is, you can't do it just anywhere, but it's still something that I think I should definately mention. If you morph out as soon as you hit the ground after falling of a ledge, the animation is skipped. Every single time. I don't know if this could potentially be useful, but I DEFINATELY think I should mention it.

Unfortunately, I have tried bomb jumping to produce the same effect, but to no avail. It may be that you need to be going at a certain speed. If anything more comes up about this, I'll post right away.
---
"I gets soooooooooooooo annoying!" ~ BlueWizard13
"I love to hear people praise me so please feel free to tell me how good I am." ~ jibtothemax
From: Zero IX | Posted: 2/26/2003 11:21:30 PM
This. Is. Not. A. Bump.

Or maybe it is. =P

Good luck w/ the Magmoor sans Varia run.
---
I need a new sig. Wahoo!
From: Ragnarok72 | Posted: 2/27/2003 11:23:18 AM
>2) Listen up, Magmoor w/o Varia people: I have discovered a method for morphing out of Morph Ball mode and skipping the animation. Bad news is, you can't do it just anywhere, but it's still something that I think I should definately mention. If you morph out as soon as you hit the ground after falling of a ledge, the animation is skipped. Every single time. I don't know if this could potentially be useful, but I DEFINATELY think I should mention it.

Yay! Someone confirmed the glitch for me!

Actually, there is another time it'll skip it. If you morph out just as you exit a morph ball tunnel, you should skip it. It'll take some trying to get it down, but I've done it accidentally in the Chozo Ruins, in the room where you first get the Morph ball (you know, the tunnel under the half-pipe?)
From: Snoopdigger XP | Posted: 2/27/2003 7:10:36 PM
Page Three
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Proud participant in the Varia-less Magmoor run!
Current time: 52 seconds
From: Varsis Erion | Posted: 2/27/2003 11:32:52 PM
I hadn't really noticed this board... in fact, until the beginning of this week, I hadn't broken the sequence. Now my 100% Hard mode time is 3:50. I have one thing to definitely contribute: one new, useful move, and a good way to use it. A NIGH PAINLESS Main Quarry>Waste Disposal sans Grapple Beam!
First, kill all the pirates except the one who started at the control panel. Try to get him standing next to the tower on the Waste Disposal door side. Position accordingly, then freeze him. Now, you do a dash-jump across the pit. You'll need the Space Jump for this trick, no matter where you use it. Lock on to the frozen pirate while standing on the top platform edge near the Ice Door. Dash (dodge) off the ledge, straight towards the door, the release your lock halfway and space jump on to the ledge. It is extremely easy, you should be able to get it in a handful of minutes. I'm still looking for other places to use the Dash-Jump- More coming soon!
From: SolrFlare | Posted: 2/27/2003 11:53:44 PM
Dang man...I gotta try that one out....nice work....that could be useful
---
Solr_Flare
From: Lord Skeletor | Posted: 2/27/2003 11:58:40 PM
that... is... ingenious. I applaud you! Unless I'm mistakin, this means the first 3 trooper rooms of the phazon mines can be skipped like entirely o_O, which makes the powerbomb run on 24 percent a helluvalot easier

Well welcome to the show. We've got an IRC chat room going #MetroidPrime on Espernet

---
Shield Eaters and World Leaders have many likes alike
From: TreborSelbon | Posted: 2/28/2003 12:04:40 AM
Where were you a few days ago when I was at that spot?

---
Real programmers don't comment their code. If it was hard to write, it should be hard to understand.
From: Varsis Erion | Posted: 2/28/2003 12:09:12 AM
There is, however, one unforseen problem with going through the waste disposal: You still need to go the front way in. The wall that you destroy with the mining laser prevents you from getting the artifact for killing the phazon elite. It is, however, a major help in getting to the grappling beam and power bombs WAY faster. All you gotta do is jump over to the grappling beam; and, even better, the troopers in the room DON'T RECOGNIZE THAT YOU HAVE ENTERED!
From: Varsis Erion | Posted: 2/28/2003 12:12:29 AM
I read about your attempts, TreborSelbon, and that's why I posted... At the beginning of the week, I found Tim's FAQ, and from there went to Zell's site, and only checked this board today. And where is this IRC chatroom?
From: TreborSelbon | Posted: 2/28/2003 12:15:50 AM
On the Espernet server. #metroidprime

---
Real programmers don't comment their code. If it was hard to write, it should be hard to understand.
From: Lord Skeletor | Posted: 2/28/2003 12:17:26 AM
the server is cosmos.esper.net or irc.esper.net

Room is #MetroidPrime

Just use mIRC or somethin
---
Shield Eaters and World Leaders have many likes alike
From: TreborSelbon | Posted: 2/28/2003 12:18:44 AM
Yeah, what he said.

---
Real programmers don't comment their code. If it was hard to write, it should be hard to understand.
From: Paratroopa1 | Posted: 2/28/2003 12:21:04 AM
Damn. That is just so ingenious... I cannot believe I haven't thought of it yet. Excellent work. This is pretty big. Perhaps it could be applied elsewhere...? *coughmetroidquarantineacough*

Don't you dare go and try Metroid Quarantine A yet, though. It's mine! Mine, I tell you! I will figure this one out! Mwahahaha!!! </insanity>
---
"I gets soooooooooooooo annoying!" ~ BlueWizard13
"I love to hear people praise me so please feel free to tell me how good I am." ~ jibtothemax
From: kip | Posted: 2/28/2003 10:01:06 AM
not sure if this is already widely known, but i just found this out for myself today so i'll toss it out there anyway; after you grab the x-ray visor and artifact in life grove, you can leave without triggering that fight against the 3 ghosts, which is a good time saver.

to do this, just look around the immediate area where you picked up the x-ray visor. there's several small, thin ledges of grass that come up from the ground. jump on the tallest one (you should still be on the "inner" part of the room before you used the power bomb to destroy the wall, not outside somewhere), then do an l-lock space jump to the entrance from where you first dropped down to get to the x-ray visor. then just leave and you'll never fight the ghosts, since they're triggered by going to a certain part of the room.
From: darklich | Posted: 2/28/2003 10:47:48 AM
did zell stop updating the site? there have been a lot of tips lately but its all in this big mess of a thread
From: Amasawa | Posted: 2/28/2003 2:00:12 PM
nice work on breaking down magmoor w/o varia. Looks like it's almost within reach. gotta try to work on that some time.

varsis, nice find with the dash-space jump move. knew about the weirdness with the triggers and the wall that the mining cannon destroys, but that could come in handy in other places. I agree; avoiding triggers for the pirates can be very helpful. Use that to your advantage whenever you can; there are other places in the game where it can work to your benefit too.

kip, I didn't know about that either and WANTED to be able to skip that battle. Thanks for the info.

para, thanks for the info on the morphing thing; that makes sense to me. I usually saw that when trying to make some tricky bomb jumps up the frozen pike w/o space jump, and wasn't sure why it was happening other than that it happened on jumps where I didn't have much room to work with (i.e. low ceiling).

i have absolutely nothing to contribute. <=) Haven't been playing MP lately.... *runs away with all of the goodies gleaned from the thread
---
Metroid Prime Discoveries
http://membres.lycos.fr/zell99/metroid
From: mark2k51 | Posted: 2/28/2003 2:00:49 PM
I've read this entire thread, and just though I'd say Good Luck to all you Magmoor runners.

--- BUMP!
The SF 49'ers rule all, admit it.
"HE COULD, GO, ALL, THE, WAY....."
From: CodeMaster13 | Posted: 2/28/2003 2:42:24 PM
Yea, I really hope you can get through Magmoor without Varia Suit. Best of luck everyone trying on that, and also good luck on the Metroid Quarantine A without Spiderball. Is it possible to get out of Phazon Mines from the Elite Quarters?
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Favorite Games: GTA: Vice City, Metroid Prime, Mario Sunshine, and TLO Zelda: Ocarina of Time
From: Amasawa | Posted: 2/28/2003 3:20:57 PM
codemaster: yeah, thanks to kip's little trick to climb the phazon proc center and ore proc w/o spider ball, getting out of the mines without it is already a reality.
---
Metroid Prime Discoveries
http://membres.lycos.fr/zell99/metroid
From: Zapking | Posted: 2/28/2003 3:37:50 PM
O_O!! Wow, I would just like to say, good job on all these new* findings. (* = New to me, considering I haven't played Metroid Prime in the LONGEST of time.)

Last time I checked, 28% was the minimum completion percentage and the Triple Bomb Jump was just a rumor.
---
"To be forgotten is worse than death." -Freya
From: hpsolo | Posted: 3/1/2003 12:01:12 AM
Don't know if this has already been posted, but I happened to find this on accident.

This is for the furnace room in the Chozo Ruins where you have to set off a power bomb to reveal a half-pipe for boost balling up to some rails and eventually get a missle expansion. (Later in the game, Chozo ghosts appear here)

There are two segments in which you have to carefully roll, past creatures along a pipe all while these creatures run along the pipe. There is a spot where you have to drop from one spider-ball rail to a lower one. If you drop correctly, you can fall on top of the rail below and use a double bomb jump and magnetize to the railing that leads straight up to the missle expansion. This saves you from having to

1) drop at the correct spot onto the second non-rail pipe where you have to morph-roll

2) traversing that second pipe (non-rail)

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Cheers,
hpsolo (Metroid Speed Runs @ http://www.classicgaming.com/msr)
From: DEVILBIT | Posted: 3/1/2003 7:00:11 PM
Hi.
For hsolo, youll find this on page 5 (10 post rule) of this very topic.

Also the furnance missile expansion can be grabbed without bombing the floor. At the back of the generator (facing from the ice door) theres a hole in the wall were you can latch. From there jump to the magnetic rail above, on the second jump press sideways, shell clinch there. From there jump to the rail at samus back. From there to the tubes on the front. Once up there is possible to grab the missile exp., if you dont have spider its trickier cause it needs a very well placed bomb jump.

This saves you the need of using the power bomb and lets you skip must of the track.
From: Amasawa | Posted: 3/1/2003 7:10:34 PM
thx for posting that again DEVILBIT; I was just mentioning that to someone today but couldn't recall exactly what you did to get it. hopefully they'll see it this time.
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Metroid Prime Discoveries
http://membres.lycos.fr/zell99/metroid
From: ZakAttak | Posted: 3/2/2003 1:42:50 AM
bump
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Leon / FOmar / 117 / Yellowboze ||| Draco / HUmar / 68 / Whitill
Pi / RAcast / 1 / Pinkal ||| Krystal / FOnewearl / 5 / Redria
From: Knux Chao | Posted: 3/2/2003 2:44:04 PM
BUMP
U
M
P
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Proud owner of a Light, Angel, and Devil Chaos Chao!
SADX should be called Sonic Adventure Cubed and you know it.
From: l2ag3 | Posted: 3/2/2003 8:11:22 PM
bump -_-. stoopid espernet isnt letting me connect... bah...
---
#MetroidPrime on Esper.net <- Metroid Prime Discoveries
"Ze Corn Beef does not run from Ze Cabage!" - pepe le pew
From: TreborSelbon | Posted: 3/2/2003 11:08:56 PM
I would've asked this in the chat, but I'm having all kinds of computer trouble (I'm on my old one).

I'm saved at the elevator behind Thardus' lair. Now, I'm going to go to Phendrana's Edge first, then to the control tower. Now, here's the dilemma. Should I go back the way I came, and head to the Chozo Ice Temple through Thardus' Lair? Or should I continue out the Pirate Base and head to the Chozo Ice Temple that way?

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Real programmers don't comment their code. If it was hard to write, it should be hard to understand.
From: Lord Skeletor | Posted: 3/2/2003 11:18:53 PM
well if you wanna know what I'd do

The pirate base seems a bit of hassle to me so I went back to the elevator and into magmoor

since you still have to get the suntower artifact anways, you'll want to be saved in magmoor right under the chozo ruins elevator that takes you to the suntower

So go from where you are to that save point

along the way you pass moniter station

so go to phendrana by that rout. the Ice temple is easiest to get to from the magmoor elevator after all

then grab the thing and head back to magmoor and continue on to suntower

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Shield Eaters and World Leaders have many likes alike
From: TreborSelbon | Posted: 3/2/2003 11:33:28 PM
So, you want me to go from here to the Edge, then to Control Tower. After that, backtrack to this same elevator and go to The Chozo Ice temple via the Monitor Station?

Then go to Chozo Ruins...obviously

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Real programmers don't comment their code. If it was hard to write, it should be hard to understand.
From: Lord Skeletor | Posted: 3/2/2003 11:39:32 PM
that's my notion
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Shield Eaters and World Leaders have many likes alike
From: TreborSelbon | Posted: 3/2/2003 11:44:44 PM
Sounds like a plan.

Thanks...and I plan to be back in full capacity tomorrow night.

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Real programmers don't comment their code. If it was hard to write, it should be hard to understand.
From: Mario Cleanstuff | Posted: 3/3/2003 10:39:39 AM
BUMP! I'm stuck at home today because I'm sick so I have nothing to do aside from play MP... <sarcasm>Pity me</sarcasm>!!! BUMP!

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"I tend to procrastinate, and sometimes I even put that off." -Me "BOOMP! thiaes toppick needseses two stae alyve!"-Me on the MP board
HOO-AH! 62
From: Mario Cleanstuff | Posted: 3/3/2003 12:43:29 PM
Durr... bump again?

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"I tend to procrastinate, and sometimes I even put that off." -Me "BOOMP! thiaes toppick needseses two stae alyve!"-Me on the MP board
HOO-AH! 62
From: Ragnarok72 | Posted: 3/3/2003 6:09:21 PM
I'm giving this a much needed BUMP.....

And I am OFFICIALLY frustrated with the Space Jump before Flaahgra trick, particularly the dbjm of the back of the Gunship.

I've watched the video demonstration and I'm no closer to getting it accomplished. I seriously need some pointers, particularly on bomb positioning, because the momentum/height just isn't there.
From: montypylon10189 | Posted: 3/3/2003 7:06:50 PM
WTF?! On my latest speed file, i just beat OP and im in Elite Control. I entered the back way as usual and the wall you blast with the pulse cannon is still there. How do i get rid of it? Its never happened to me b4.... I tried power bombing it and everything.
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Metroid Prime- Hard-100% 3:55, Hard-24% 3:23, Normal 2:21 SMS-117 shines SFA-99% SSBM- 287trophies SA2:B- 175 emblems MLB Slugfest 2003- Allstar season 52-0
From: TreborSelbon | Posted: 3/3/2003 11:23:04 PM
monty: have you been through Elite Research before (from the front way)?

If not, I think we've found the problem with going from Main Quarry to Waste Disposal without Grappling Beam.

Sess: I timed the different routes from the Control Tower to the Chozo Ice Temple. The route through Thardus' Lair is faster by about 2 and a half minutes.

Now, for my next dilemma: the Sun Tower. BAH. I might not have a controller by the end of the day tomorrow.

Oh, and my good computer is still broken. There's no telling when it'll be fixed.

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Real programmers don't comment their code. If it was hard to write, it should be hard to understand.
From: Amasawa | Posted: 3/3/2003 11:36:42 PM
I've gone through the back route in the mines many times but have always been blocked by that wall. If you've gone through it before without using the mining cannon, then you know something I don't. No other way to destroy it afaik.

Trebor, the best advice I could give you for the suntower is be patient, and make what progress you can little by little. Don't expect to get it in one play session... and that way, if you do, you can be pleasantly surprised. <=)
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Metroid Prime Discoveries
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From: LazyVeysey | Posted: 3/4/2003 3:53:49 AM
Ragnarok72 - i had a problem with that for the longest time... put prob. 10 hours of time into practice before i got it... umm... what i found was, lay your 2nd bomb at the last possible second (right before or even as the first blows up).. lay your third as high as possible (as you prob already know)
now... just after the second blows propelling you up.. jam forward (of course the third bomb should propel you as well)... try practicing that part on the ground first to get the timing down...
now just moments after the third hits, come out of the morph ball form.... if all goes well... one of two things will happen... one you make it and are very happy.... or two, you miss but would swear on your life that you should have made it...
i hope this helped... good luck...
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MP Nrm 3:32 100% Hrd N/A MM 38:10.80
HRC 46688.5 ft BtT 5:22.60
From: Knux Chao | Posted: 3/4/2003 2:35:19 PM
bumpa
bumpa
bumpa

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Proud owner of a Light, Angel, and Devil Chaos Chao!
SADX should be called Sonic Adventure Cubed and you know it.
From: Ragnarok72 | Posted: 3/4/2003 6:31:33 PM
>Ragnarok72 - i had a problem with that for the longest time... put prob. 10 hours of time into practice before i got it... umm... what i found was, lay your 2nd bomb at the last possible second (right before or even as the first blows up).. lay your third as high as possible (as you prob already know)
now... just after the second blows propelling you up.. jam forward (of course the third bomb should propel you as well)... try practicing that part on the ground first to get the timing down...
now just moments after the third hits, come out of the morph ball form.... if all goes well... one of two things will happen... one you make it and are very happy.... or two, you miss but would swear on your life that you should have made it...
i hope this helped... good luck...

I see. I'll try doing that, as I think my problem is the timing/position of the second bomb. Thank you for explaining it in a little more detail. :p
From: TreborSelbon | Posted: 3/4/2003 8:51:09 PM
I notice there's no vid for Sun Tower sans Super Missile.

Give me a week to get the equipment, and I'll have one for zell's site. I already have it on tape, I just need to convert it to ...something digital.

The bad news is I'm still saved before the Sun Tower. Because it's a speed run, I can't take forever to climb the tower... so I had to restart.

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Real programmers don't comment their code. If it was hard to write, it should be hard to understand.
From: kip | Posted: 3/4/2003 9:21:17 PM
for any folks that are having trouble with early space jump, i posted a link to a video of it (and the best text explanation i could manage to come up with right now) in metalifreak's topic. check it out and see if it helps i guess...
From: Amasawa | Posted: 3/4/2003 11:49:11 PM
nice job, trebor. I'm sure if you could get that digitized peeps would appreciate it. Heck I prolly would; I kinda just took a guess at the placement of the last two bombs when I finally made it. <=]h
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Metroid Prime Discoveries
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From: TreborSelbon | Posted: 3/5/2003 12:34:37 AM
My biggest problem is the first two bombs. About half the time, they don't boost me high enough. If I get those set up perfectly, I can get it every time.

Maybe I'll finish this 24% game tomorrow...

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Real programmers don't comment their code. If it was hard to write, it should be hard to understand.
From: keybladeswordsman | Posted: 3/5/2003 8:51:24 AM
Could someone explain to me how EXACTLY Varsis Erion's dash-jump technique works?
Like if it could be recreated somewhere else?
It could help us magmoor w/o varia runners
From: annoynweirdklown | Posted: 3/5/2003 5:05:26 PM
bump
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Clowns are NOT scary...non-clowns are.
From: Mario Cleanstuff | Posted: 3/5/2003 9:52:16 PM
much-needed BUMP!

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"I tend to procrastinate, and sometimes I even put that off." -Me "BOOMP! thiaes toppick needseses two stae alyve!"-Me on the MP board
HOO-AH! 62
From: Knux Chao | Posted: 3/6/2003 2:56:39 PM
BUMPa

this topic's dying...
we've found all there is to find...
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Proud owner of a Light, Angel, and Devil Chaos Chao!
SADX should be called Sonic Adventure Cubed and you know it.
From: annoynweirdklown | Posted: 3/6/2003 4:34:41 PM
*agrees with above poster*

bump
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Clowns are NOT scary...non-clowns are.
From: Grinto | Posted: 3/7/2003 3:57:14 AM
The only thing left is the Varia-less Magmoor runs... Are those still even being done anymore?
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Roboticus is Champion!
From: Samus aran x | Posted: 3/7/2003 7:27:36 AM
yes they are.............and i think i found a way thru metroid quarentine a witout spiderball........................more details and a possible picture or two coming later today or tomorrow after i get out of school.............wait teacher coming! finish post later!
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(what's good about a clock radio) well you can listen to it, and see exactly what time your listening to.. Im listeing to 11:00 P.M....lol
From: keybladeswordsman | Posted: 3/7/2003 1:27:09 PM
Someone tell me how does the dash jump work so I can go do Varialess magmoor!!!!!
From: Amasawa | Posted: 3/7/2003 2:09:17 PM
For what it's worth, I confirm Suikun's discovery of the no-win game situation that occurs if you get the thermal visor before you've either a) already gotten the artifact from the Control Tower, or b) activated the hologram in the observatory. Trebor and anyone else who suggested this might be the case earlier is correct.

No matter what I've tried, the window in the big debut Metroid-busts-out scene won't break after the thermal visor's been picked up (so unless you've already broken it once before that, yer screwed), and I have no idea how to climb the observatory all the way to the top without activating the hologram first. Never mind that the glass breaking schtick works just the way I said it does if you try heading to the control tower from the frozen pike the first time you enter the research labs if you don't grab the thermal visor... =P

Poor suikun must have been ready to tear my arms off and feed 'em to his ex-girlfriend with all the "help" I was trying to offer earlier -- none of which is valid, apparently, once the thermal's been acquired.

And now, for my next trick: Finish MP after my right arm's been surgically removed by a vicious shark!

Here, Suikunrules... *hands suikun an arm ... this limb's for you.

Zell, if you're still alive out there, it'd be really helpful if you could put Suikunrules' info up there and credit him for it so no other would-be sequence breakers have to suffer the same frustration. =)
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Metroid Prime Discoveries
http://membres.lycos.fr/zell99/metroid
From: Amasawa | Posted: 3/7/2003 2:10:30 PM
keyblade, I haven't tried it myself, so I can't help. <=( Hopefully he/someone else who has will see this...
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Metroid Prime Discoveries
http://membres.lycos.fr/zell99/metroid
From: kip | Posted: 3/7/2003 4:27:54 PM
for a dash jump, just do a dash but let go of L (and everything else) shortly after she starts it. she should go flying, but remember that you have to trade in your first jump for this (i could still see it being useful in monitor station and that one room with the magmoor).
From: Amasawa | Posted: 3/7/2003 4:38:45 PM
random useless tidbits:

you can't go the back way through the research labs ALL the way through on one pass the first time. there's a force field that can only be opened from the front side.

at the phendrana shorelines, you can space jump up to the cliff where the chozo ice temple is by pushing against the rock on the right side of the room as you face the cliff.

I just post these cuz I appreciate it when other peeps do, not cuz they're really worth anything. <=)
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Metroid Prime Discoveries
http://membres.lycos.fr/zell99/metroid
From: CodeMaster13 | Posted: 3/7/2003 8:20:15 PM
Samas Aran X, did you get through the one room in Phazon Mines without Spider Ball? If so, that is one more item you could skip. Just one room is the problem...... Is there any way to get Grapple Beam before Thardus? That would help a lot in the one room. Well, it looks that 2 items more have a potential to being skipped. Let's hope Magmoor without Varia is actually possible... I'm sure it is though.
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Favorite Games: GTA: Vice City, Metroid Prime, Mario Sunshine, and TLO Zelda: Ocarina of Time
From: Mario Cleanstuff | Posted: 3/7/2003 8:59:12 PM
BUMPsigchangeBUMP!

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http://www.geocities.com/metroidcartoonist/night_vision.html "BOOMP! thiaes toppick needseses two stae alyve!"-Me on the MP board
HOO-AH! 62
From: TreborSelbon | Posted: 3/7/2003 11:52:22 PM
Getting through MQA serves no real purpose any more. You still need the Spider Ball to get up the Sun Tower.

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Real programmers don't comment their code. If it was hard to write, it should be hard to understand.
From: Paratroopa1 | Posted: 3/8/2003 3:10:31 AM
Dude, Phazon Suit before Thardus.

And it's one step closer.
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"I gets soooooooooooooo annoying!" ~ BlueWizard13
"I love to hear people praise me so please feel free to tell me how good I am." ~ jibtothemax
From: Yoritoki Komatsu | Posted: 3/8/2003 3:15:46 AM
MQA without spider ball is POSSIBLE just go up to the ledge with the rocket and jump to the beam thats closest to the exit door go all the way to the wall still standing on the beam and space jump to the ledge
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"geocities.com/sodohobo" justin is a funnyman
From: Paratroopa1 | Posted: 3/8/2003 3:24:02 AM
Nice try. Now please stop existing.
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"I gets soooooooooooooo annoying!" ~ BlueWizard13
"I love to hear people praise me so please feel free to tell me how good I am." ~ jibtothemax
From: Yoritoki Komatsu | Posted: 3/8/2003 3:27:49 AM
sodohobo even said he would post a video on his website
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"geocities.com/sodohobo" justin is a funnyman
From: Suikunrules | Posted: 3/8/2003 3:40:21 AM
OMG! I was mentioned again!

Amasawa, I'm not vengeful or anything, really. Besides, I can't exactly feed your limb to an ex-girlfriend of mine if I don't have one. ;O

BUT I'LL EAT IT MYSELF!

*chomping and ripping noises are heard*

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"im blow drying it" - RabidSheep, on SC:BW, in reference to trying cleaning his mouse with some water (See quote)
From: Snoopdigger XP | Posted: 3/8/2003 11:33:02 AM
Here's a little tip for getting through doors fast on the Varia-less Magmoor run. If you are in morph ball mode (which you should be since it is fastest) drop a bomb at the door. Morph out, and you should gain control of Samus the same time the door open. Beautiful!
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Proud participant in the Varia-less Magmoor run!
Current time: 52 seconds
From: Amasawa | Posted: 3/8/2003 12:36:40 PM
*cowers in fear of suikun's arm-mauling ferocity

yeah, I figured you'd be cool 'bout it, but I still feel bad. Oh well, there's always my other arm!

*promptly gets attacked by a horde of killer bees and dies
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Metroid Prime Discoveries
http://membres.lycos.fr/zell99/metroid
From: keybladeswordsman | Posted: 3/8/2003 1:18:07 PM
I'm currently testing this dash jump so I can find a way to use it on our Varialess magmoor. IT is possible but it will require skill and a lot of LUCK. *playing slots and gets three 7s* Yahoo! Snoop might do this before me because he made it to transport tunnel A and I am stuck in moniter station even though I followed his strategy.

*Attaches a new, fake arm on Amasawa and revives him*
From: keybladeswordsman | Posted: 3/8/2003 1:20:16 PM
BTW, Suikunrules, wouldn't eating Amasawa's arm make you a cannibal(sp)?
From: Yoritoki Komatsu | Posted: 3/8/2003 1:32:33 PM
i guess it's possible to get through magmoor w/o the varia suit but do you freeze in phendrana?
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"geocities.com/sodohobo" justin is a funnyman
From: keybladeswordsman | Posted: 3/8/2003 1:34:16 PM
Thats one thing we are trying to find out.
From: Shadow82v | Posted: 3/8/2003 2:41:30 PM
If this hasn't been posted before, If you go the other way around to face thardus, and Jump. there will be no cut-scene.
You can jump on the rocks and get hurt, but if your still on tharus's rocks between ten seconds you won't get hurt!
But after ten seconds, on its rocks, you will get hurt again.
you have to go in front of thardus to activate the cot-sccene. Hop I could help!
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"Thank the lord!" my friend that believes there is no god.
From: TreborSelbon | Posted: 3/8/2003 10:36:15 PM
Ahhh...I stand corrected. Phazon before Thardus would pwn.

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Real programmers don't comment their code. If it was hard to write, it should be hard to understand.
From: Videogaming | Posted: 3/8/2003 10:51:56 PM
Eh, I've kinda been behind on this topic...though it seems to be dying a slow and painful death...

Anyway, what is a dash jump, how far does it go, and how do you execute it?
From: TreborSelbon | Posted: 3/8/2003 11:40:17 PM
Lock on to an enemy.
Dash (will probably be off a ledge of some sort).
As you start to dash, release your lock, as well as anything else, I guess.
Then, just do your second jump like normal (you might could do it like an L-lock spring jump. Maybe).

I haven't tested it, but that's how I think it works.

It should get you tons of distance, but height is a problem. You'll need to be aiming for something lower than your starting point.

Correct me if I'm wrong, anyone.

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Real programmers don't comment their code. If it was hard to write, it should be hard to understand.
From: Videogaming | Posted: 3/9/2003 12:05:55 AM
You mean, a strafe jump?
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Opinions are like buttholes. Everyone has one.
From: TreborSelbon | Posted: 3/9/2003 12:47:16 AM
You could look at it that way, but you don't exactly strafe. You have to dash with the B button.

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Real programmers don't comment their code. If it was hard to write, it should be hard to understand.
From: Knux Chao | Posted: 3/9/2003 6:13:17 PM
hmm... it's not much, and someone probably found it before, but I found a way into quarantine monitor(the little area by thardus that you grapple to) before grapple.

all you do is enter the room after beating thardy and lead the sheegoth near the ledge. kill it and jump onto it before it dissapears. space jump onto the ledge and you're there.

technically, it does fall under the category of sequence breaking, right?
and if no one found this before, I get the credit?
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Proud owner of a Light, Angel, and Devil Chaos Chao!
SADX should be called Sonic Adventure Cubed and you know it.
From: Amasawa | Posted: 3/9/2003 6:20:22 PM
cool, thanks for the info. haven't heard that before, so it's new as far as I know at least.
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Metroid Prime Discoveries
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From: montypylon10189 | Posted: 3/9/2003 6:35:14 PM
Hey if we all really want the question answered about Phendrana drifts, then why doesnt somebody get there with action replay then save, take the action replay out, and see if it hurts us?
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"Highly Metal-ized by the Space Gorons, Dragon can breath fire and burninate anything! Fear his 1337 powers!"--dejitaru davis on "Dragon" aka Meta-Ridley
From: Zero IX | Posted: 3/9/2003 7:05:11 PM
I doubt Phendrana's temp will hurt because the programmers prolly didn't intend for people to over there without the Varia.

Anyway, I'm in the middle of a 24% game. Any tips for navigating the crashed frigate without the Gravity Suit? Also, just how hard is it to get to the Sun Tower without the Grapple Beam? X'D
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[sigless]
From: Amasawa | Posted: 3/9/2003 8:07:09 PM
Any tips for navigating the crashed frigate without the Gravity Suit?

Remember that pushing against slanted surfaces for a second as you start your jumps and then pulling away adds height. Use this to your advantage whenever you're stuck and looking for a way to progress without specific info.

The explanation that Youkai Sesshoumaru offered about boosting through hydro access is excellent, so take a look at that again if you can; I think it's in this topic somewhere. Holding up, then pushing down and boosting is key until you get your first big boost. If the first boost doesn't work, make sure to push up and then down again before you try to boost again, or you may go flying into the e-tank accidentally (if you wind up floating to the top unintentionally)

Also, just how hard is it to get to the Sun Tower without the Grapple Beam? X'D

you mean, w/o super missiles? pretty damn hard imo, but again sesshoumaru's description is excellent and it's very much doable.

Good luck and have fun!
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Metroid Prime Discoveries
http://membres.lycos.fr/zell99/metroid
From: Zero IX | Posted: 3/9/2003 8:21:53 PM
My bad, I meant getting to the Tower of Light without the Grapple Beam with only 99 units of energy to spare. =(
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[sigless]
From: Amasawa | Posted: 3/9/2003 8:35:49 PM
sorry, but I'm still confused. =( Do you mean is it difficult to get to that point in the game with 99 energy period, or is it difficult to fight the ghosts? I'm not sure how the grapple beam plays into what you're talking about...
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Metroid Prime Discoveries
http://membres.lycos.fr/zell99/metroid
From: hpsolo | Posted: 3/9/2003 8:41:12 PM
Thought this was interesting -- on the subject of Super Metroid specifically, but applies to sequence breaking in general.

And if the developers of Metroid never intended for you to skip the Varia Suit collections, dont you think they would have found it during the testing phase, and made sure that it is required? And Retro is such a big fan, I'm sure they would have known about that, and prevented it too if it wasn't intended by the orignal developers... So, my point is... IT WAS INTENDED! The guides never say anything about secret routes, etc. They just tell you the easiest and most complete way to finish the game. The Developers intended you to be able to skip things, if not, all of Norfair would have been super heated, requiring you to have the Varia suit all the time, but it had safe zones that were close enough together that you can get through without dieing.

I was wondering what you guys thought of this comment.

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Cheers,
hpsolo (Metroid Speed Runs @ http://www.classicgaming.com/msr)
From: Zero IX | Posted: 3/9/2003 8:46:58 PM
The Tower of Light, the room with the Wavebuster and that one artifact (too lazy to check). How do you cross that magma pool area without the hookshot?
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[sigless]
From: Little Green Yoda | Posted: 3/9/2003 8:57:08 PM
Isn't the Tower of Light close to the Ruined Shrine (where you get the Morph Ball)? The only magma pool I can think of is before the Training Room. And apologies in advance if I get all of this wrong; it's been a while since I've played.
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"Death to the Hunter! Death to all those who oppose us!"
-intergalactic Space Pirates in their pathetic attempt to take over the universe
From: Amasawa | Posted: 3/9/2003 8:59:10 PM
There's no guarantee at all that sequence breaking was intended in MP. It's possible, but for all we know, Retro could have had a lot of enemy characteristics programmed a certain way to start with, so that various items worked on all kinds of enemies, and then worked on specific item/enemy placement later.

On the flip side, yes, you could certainly argue that Retro figured players would find ways to skip items or collect them in a different order, so they programmed enemies the way they did specifically for that reason. Either way, I highly doubt that the developers were aware of everything that could be done in terms of item skipping. It's not practical for them to have to design in all the flat (stuff Samus can stand on) or solid (stuff Samus can't pass through) surfaces intentionally; takes way too much time. Would be much quicker to just base "flat" and "solid" surfaces on some kind of algorithm, and then "smooth over" surfaces where they definitely knew they didn't want Samus to be able to stand or pass through.

For example, many of the open ceiling areas are made "solid" even though they don't look it, to prevent Samus from passing out of the playable area. There's a small part of the open ceiling in transport tunnel c, however, which allows Samus to pass through. Is it likely that Retro left this in as a "hidden world" for the players to find. Doubt it -- not impossible, but it's far more likely that they just overlooked a spot that they never figured would be a problem. And as for the visors, the thermal can be completely skipped but for some reason the x-ray visor can't -- why? Seems like it wouldn't be THAT hard to program a little differently if they'd considered item skipping in that regard, so that you could skip both visors altogether.

Anyway, that's my two cents on the issue, and again, I'm not saying it's impossible Retro didn't anticipate any sequence breaking; I just doubt that they knew about/caught in testing every possible thing that's been found so far.

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Metroid Prime Discoveries
http://membres.lycos.fr/zell99/metroid
From: Amasawa | Posted: 3/9/2003 9:01:41 PM
no, you're right little green yoda -- so zero IX, all you really need to get back to where the artifact behind the tower of light is the wave beam; no grapple beam required. (and you won't need to deal with the wavebusterin a 24% run)
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Metroid Prime Discoveries
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From: Zero IX | Posted: 3/9/2003 9:07:10 PM
BTW, I'm still thanking the blind squirrel in your brain that figured out that ingenius method of getting the Plasma Beam before Thardus, Amasawa. =)
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[sigless]
From: TreborSelbon | Posted: 3/9/2003 9:24:59 PM
I don't know if zell's still updating the site, but I can confirm that method for getting through Hydro Access. I'll even get it on vid later this week, just as soon as I get my computer back.

Obviously, I did this a long time ago, but I was just reminded by the guy asking about it. I even wrote a brief walkthrough. I think it's in here somewhere...

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Real programmers don't comment their code. If it was hard to write, it should be hard to understand.
From: Amasawa | Posted: 3/9/2003 9:27:43 PM
BTW, I'm still thanking the blind squirrel in your brain that figured out that ingenius method of getting the Plasma Beam before Thardus, Amasawa. =)

You gotta thank kip for that one. He's the one that figured out how to get to the door at the top without the spider ball.

but yeah, the blind squirrel did manage to find that way up to the spinner platforms w/o grapple. =) I try to take good care of him and feed him every once in a while to see if he'll come up with anything else, but mostly he just gets fat and laughs at me.
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Metroid Prime Discoveries
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From: Mario Cleanstuff | Posted: 3/9/2003 9:51:13 PM
Give it the SubWay diet, and try to take it to an optometrist. Maybe get it fixed. Then it would stop laughing!

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"BOOMP! thiaes toppick needseses two stae alyve!"-Me on the MP board HOO-AH! 62
From: Amasawa | Posted: 3/9/2003 9:56:09 PM
now *I* can't stop laughing, though. =D Better give me a gruel-flavored cookie!
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Metroid Prime Discoveries
http://membres.lycos.fr/zell99/metroid
From: Mario Cleanstuff | Posted: 3/9/2003 10:18:59 PM
Fine.

*Hands Amasawa round lump of gruel*

But that's the only cookie you'll see from me in this topic!

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http://www.geocities.com/metroidcartoonist/night_vision.html
"BOOMP! thiaes toppick needseses two stae alyve!"-Me on the MP board HOO-AH! 62
From: Mario Cleanstuff | Posted: 3/9/2003 10:19:34 PM
Oh... and what can't you stop laughing at?

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http://www.geocities.com/metroidcartoonist/night_vision.html
"BOOMP! thiaes toppick needseses two stae alyve!"-Me on the MP board HOO-AH! 62
From: Amasawa | Posted: 3/9/2003 11:02:49 PM
I can't stop laughing about your comment that getting [the squirrel] fixed would make it stop laughing. =)
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Metroid Prime Discoveries
http://membres.lycos.fr/zell99/metroid
From: Mario Cleanstuff | Posted: 3/9/2003 11:10:47 PM
Ah. I would sig meself there, but I'm booked full... I do so like those sentences...
<subliminal message>sig me... sig me... sig me...</subliminal message>

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http://www.geocities.com/metroidcartoonist/night_vision.html
"BOOMP! thiaes toppick needseses two stae alyve!"-Me on the MP board HOO-AH! 62
From: Videogaming | Posted: 3/9/2003 11:24:53 PM
LMAO at the blind squirrel joke...Maybe I'll sig it later...XD

Zell, its high time for an update. Make sure you get everything in this topic. I imagine it will be one of the few more you're going to make, considering the progress recently...
From: Mario Cleanstuff | Posted: 3/9/2003 11:29:22 PM
"Give it the SubWay diet, and try to take it to an optometrist. Maybe get it fixed. Then it would stop laughing!" -Mario Cleanstuff on the blind squirrel in Amasawa's brain that laughs at him

I'd sig that if i could. Those exact words. I do so like them... (NOTE: Might be too long, cut out as little as possible. If it don't fit, take out the SubWay diet part. "Try to take it to...")

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http://www.geocities.com/metroidcartoonist/night_vision.html
"BOOMP! thiaes toppick needseses two stae alyve!"-Me on the MP board HOO-AH! 62
From: Xenesis Xenon | Posted: 3/10/2003 7:11:22 AM
Argh...I'm trying to get the plasma beam early. I can do everything up to getting onto the steel rail. However, I can't get on the spider ball block-track thing. It's driving me crazy (2ish hours of trying). Anyone got some help? I try on both sides. One side keeps dumping me into the lava, and the other side doesn't give me enough height! Argh!

PS. Unless someone tells me where to get divx for mac, I can't watch the movies.
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Cid: Disgruntled old man that cusses a lot. Never thought I'd find a game that featured my dad Chaotyx on FF7.
Webpage:See Quote
From: Samus aran x | Posted: 3/10/2003 3:00:27 PM
bump
bump prime
bump 2
super bump
bump fusion
(i got this from someone else so i give credit to whoever made this bump)

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lowest percentage metroid prime game 24%
1st person to complete it, - #1 metroid player amasawa! :D
From: Amasawa | Posted: 3/10/2003 3:21:21 PM
Xenon -- take a look at your topic for some suggestions for the plasma beam (http://s2.cgi.gamefaqs.com/boards/genmessage.asp?board=32495&topic=6919978)
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Metroid Prime Discoveries
http://membres.lycos.fr/zell99/metroid
From: Gold Leader | Posted: 3/10/2003 3:46:54 PM
I am willing to help in anyway posible. (just finished a 24% game)
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‚¡!¹'"'¹!¡L¡!¹'"'¹!¡E¡!¹'"'¹!¡A¡!¹'"'¹!¡D¡!¹'"'¹!¡E¡!¹'"'¹!¡R¡!¹'"'¹!¡,
From: Amasawa | Posted: 3/10/2003 3:57:30 PM
Sweet! Nice job Gold Leader.
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Metroid Prime Discoveries
http://membres.lycos.fr/zell99/metroid
From: Gold Leader | Posted: 3/10/2003 4:12:53 PM
thanks amasawa. Omega Pirate was a ***** with no charge beam nor missiles or energy tanks. I had a 25% game because I forgot not to get the charge beam. Is there anyway I can help?

P.S.- have you guy completed a varia-less run yet?
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‚¡!¹'"'¹!¡L¡!¹'"'¹!¡E¡!¹'"'¹!¡A¡!¹'"'¹!¡D¡!¹'"'¹!¡E¡!¹'"'¹!¡R¡!¹'"'¹!¡,
From: montypylon10189 | Posted: 3/10/2003 4:39:19 PM
Not Quite, Gold Leader, but ive come REALLY close a few times, so i dunno. Maybe one day, one of us will get lucky and a puffer will drop an ultra energy. Although, if we really wanna know if Phendrana drifts damages us, why doesn't someone with an action replay use it to get there, then save, take it out, and restart without an action replay?
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"Highly Metal-ized by the Space Gorons, Dragon can breath fire and burninate anything! Fear his 1337 powers!"--dejitaru davis on "Dragon" aka Meta-Ridley
From: kirby dude | Posted: 3/10/2003 6:09:18 PM
What was the room you came furthest in? In my last trial, I came into the fourth room (I think that's Lava Lake)
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From: Snoopdigger XP | Posted: 3/10/2003 6:25:53 PM
Hello? Zell99, you still out there? You still alive?
-
-
-
-
-
Oh well, he hasn't been coming here lately, or updating his site, and I wondered where he would be...

Anyway, Varia-less Magmoor is one step away. I keep trying to shave off time, and I think I could be close to a breakthrough. First off, a little math lesson:

Samus's speed = Y (I don't exactly what X is because it is hard to measure distance from 1st person)
Morph Ball speed = Y x 1.3

So Morph Ball goes .3 times faster than regular speed. However, there is transition time that gets factored into the equation.

Y x 1.3 - I - O

I = The time it takes in order to transition into morph ball mode.

0 = The time it takes in order to transition out of morph ball mode.

Now, I is about 1 second, while O is about 2.4 seconds. So the sultion to the equation is as follows:

Regular Speed = Y
Morph Ball Speed = Y x 1.3 - 1 - 2.4
^3.4

So, lets say that Y = 5 seconds. (For the rest of the equations)

Regular Speed = 5 seconds
Morph Ball Speed = 5 x 1.3 - 1 - 2.4 = 3.1 seconds

Now, we can factor out I by doing the following:

The only way to skip the coming out sequence is to overload the processor; and make it transfer you right to the first person view. You can do this by pressing against the wall with an enormous amount of speed and you should press against the wall. Then, while you are in the air, look for some cracks of crevices. Land right in there, and morph out. The animation will skip. So, the end result that we can come up with is this:

Regular Speed = Y
Morph Ball Speed = Y x 1.3 - 1 = 5.5 seconds.

And, that's not all. That is it just for whatever Y is. What if it were double the distance, for 2Y?

Regular Speed = 2Y = 10
Morph Ball Speed = 2Y x 1.3 - 1 = 12

The difference between the two is only .5 seconds at with Y. But when you go up to 2Y, it changes to 1.5. Let's try it with 3Y.

Regular Speed = 3Y = 15
Morph Ball Speed = 3Y x 1.3 - 1 = 18.5

Now the difference is 3.5. And for 4Y it would be 5. And for 5Y it would be 6.5. This goes on as a geometric sequence, with the common ratio being 1.5. Now, this is a very good concept to apply in order to make it through Magmoor Caverns. You just have to practice. And go for some long runs in morph ball mode.

On a side-note, if you place a bomb right by a door, and then morph out, you can activate the just as you regain control over Samus.

If this information helps you, please use it during the Varia-less Magmoor runs.

Waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaoooooooooooooooooooooooooo!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Proud participant in the Varia-less Magmoor run!
Current time: 52 seconds
From: Videogaming | Posted: 3/10/2003 7:50:15 PM
Too much math...

Gold Leader, what was your time(s) on 24% and 25%? You will have high scores on the list I update...

Someone should save this topic for zell if he doesn't get to updating soon.
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Opinions are like buttholes. Everyone has one.
From: Gold Leader | Posted: 3/10/2003 8:25:18 PM
my 25% was 4:35
my 24% was a little faster 4:09

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.........‚¡!¹'"'¹!¡G¡!¹'"'¹!¡O¡!¹'"'¹!¡L¡!¹'"'¹!¡D¡!¹'"'¹!¡‚
‚¡!¹'"'¹!¡L¡!¹'"'¹!¡E¡!¹'"'¹!¡A¡!¹'"'¹!¡D¡!¹'"'¹!¡E¡!¹'"'¹!¡R¡!¹'"'¹!¡,
From: Nebulus F90 | Posted: 3/10/2003 9:57:25 PM
egad, the thread needs a bump!

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Hissatsu! Seiryuu Fangu -- Impakkutto!!!
From: TreborSelbon | Posted: 3/10/2003 10:10:31 PM
Ridley in a 24% game is no joke. Especially a speed run. He just takes too long to kill.

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Real programmers don't comment their code. If it was hard to write, it should be hard to understand.
From: Xenesis Xenon | Posted: 3/11/2003 4:01:15 AM
Yay, Finally got the plasma early. The jump when I got up to it was weird though. It was almost like an old school wall jump. O.o
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Cid: Disgruntled old man that cusses a lot. Never thought I'd find a game that featured my dad Chaotyx on FF7.
Webpage:See Quote
From: RockMFR 5 | Posted: 3/11/2003 2:35:36 PM
How close are you to a Varia-less Magmoor run? Have you reached the morph ball room yet?
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<AC-972><SSBM-290><P9-DC><SMB-MASTER><SMB2-MASTER EXTRA><MKSC-WRx?> o_0
OHIO STATE-31 miami-24
From: kirby dude | Posted: 3/11/2003 3:59:08 PM
Hmm... Could this be a possible solution for Grapple Beam before Thardus?

First, you need to get all the beams early. Second, get one or two Power Bomb expansions. Go past the room with the Thermal Visor, and to the elevator to Magmoor Caverns. Once in Magmoor Workstation, head to the tunnel after it. Destroy the rubble and continue to the elevator to Phazon Mines(I'm not sure where that leads to in Phazon Mines, so this may be pointless...) Go backwards through the mines until you are in the Ore Processing room. If getting there requires Spider Ball, ignore this idea. I vaguely remember anything from this point on, so again this may be wrong. When in there, if you are on the same level as the entrance to the room with the Grapple Beam, destroy the rubble and get the Grapple Beam.
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From: montypylon10189 | Posted: 3/11/2003 3:59:34 PM
Ive gotten past the morph ball part of that room but the damn loading time killed me.
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"Highly Metal-ized by the Space Gorons, Dragon can breath fire and burninate anything! Fear his 1337 powers!"--dejitaru davis on "Dragon" aka Meta-Ridley
From: Amasawa | Posted: 3/11/2003 5:00:19 PM
kirby dude -- getting to ore processing from Elite Control (the back way) does indeed require the spider ball in one room afaik. However you can still go the front way to reach ore processing without having to worry about spider ball, and then I'm pretty sure kip's got a way to be able to jump from level to level of that room without using the spider ball at all so you should be able to reach the grapple beam that way and then escape.
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Metroid Prime Discoveries
http://membres.lycos.fr/zell99/metroid
From: kirby dude | Posted: 3/11/2003 5:22:30 PM
Ah, well.. I tried
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R-E-C-Y-C-L-E recycle C-O-N-S-E-R-V-E conserve
Don't you P-O-L-L-U-T-E pollute the river, sky, or sea or you'll get what you deserve~ Rocko's Modern Life
From: Snoopdigger XP | Posted: 3/11/2003 5:44:40 PM
montypylon10189, have you tried my morph ball bomb door-opening technique? That should save you time.
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Proud participant in the Varia-less Magmoor run!
Current time: 52 seconds
From: Amasawa | Posted: 3/11/2003 5:49:25 PM
dumb question about all this varia run time bechmarking stuff -- are these all runs where you're not taking damage from the lava, enemies, etc?

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Metroid Prime Discoveries
http://membres.lycos.fr/zell99/metroid
From: montypylon10189 | Posted: 3/11/2003 7:15:24 PM
I took no damage from enemies (in fact, most i killed and they dropped energy). The only parts i took damage from lava are the rooms where you take less damage from jumping straight through the lava rather than going around.

snoopdigger- No i didn't think about using the bomb door opening trick (DAMN IT!), but i figured the door would open in enough time to get to the transport room.

Hey do you guys think the transport room will hurt us? I don't, cuz there's no lava, but i could be wrong.
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"Highly Metal-ized by the Space Gorons, Dragon can breath fire and burninate anything! Fear his 1337 powers!"--dejitaru davis on "Dragon" aka Meta-Ridley
From: Mojoman14 | Posted: 3/11/2003 8:28:03 PM
Well, the one at the beginning of Magmoor doesn't... X_X
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Well, at least we gots some COCONUTS!- Some guy on the street with coconut shoes
From: Snoopdigger XP | Posted: 3/11/2003 9:09:41 PM
Amasawa: No, you don't take damage from enemies if you do it just right. And, depending on which method you use, you can be hurt by lava, like montypylon10189 said, when it is faster and therefore better to take a little damage.

Montypylon10189: There are several reasons why that room won't hurt us. A: Transport rooms never hurt you, because if they did Samus would get crispy fried inside the root cave elevator room. B: If the root cave elevator room, at the core of Magmoor Caverns, then why should the one at the end of Transport Tunnel A, which is right by Phendrana Drifts?

Oh, and I hereby declare myself the chief scientist of the Varia-less Magmoor run. Speak now, or forever hold your peace.

Any objections?
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Top scientist in the Varia-less Magmoor run! 52 seconds!
Y x 1.3 - I - O > 5 x 1.3 - 1 - 2.4 = 3.1 = 5.5
From: Amasawa | Posted: 3/11/2003 9:20:13 PM
snoop -- yeah, I understand what monty is talking about. I just wanted to make sure you weren't taking any damage you take into account when you're timing yourself and already have the varia suit, is what I was getting at. sounds like you are, though.
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Metroid Prime Discoveries
http://membres.lycos.fr/zell99/metroid
From: Ragnarok72 | Posted: 3/11/2003 9:56:45 PM
*Is STILL trying to get the Space Jump Early so he could start to join the others in the Varia-less run....*

So, it appears that the thread started being revived again. That's good.

Although, one thing just occured to me: Are we CERTAIN that Samus is taking damage from Magmoor's heat during the Morph Ball transition animation? I mean, for all we know, the gauge may pause and display the same value when it is redisplayed after the transition than it is before.
From: devan123 | Posted: 3/11/2003 9:58:21 PM
no, i've triede that. it does not work
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"Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former." - A. Einstein
From: Snoopdigger XP | Posted: 3/12/2003 8:29:23 AM
Well, the Varia-less Magmoor run is almost there! In the meantime, I'm going to start and alternate game and see if I can cough up 24%.
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Top scientist in the Varia-less Magmoor run! 52 seconds!
Y x 1.3 - I - O > 5 x 1.3 - 1 - 2.4 = 3.1 = 5.5
From: zell99 | Posted: 3/12/2003 8:45:48 AM
Snoop- What's the farthest you've been in Varia-Less Magmoor Run? I don't think anyone has been to the top level of Monitor Station, unless I am out of date... so how can you say we're almost there? ;) (note that this is not flaming, just curiosity)
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http://membres.lycos.fr/zell99/metroid
Y'all [...] make sure it's popin' when we get up there... -Tupac
From: DEVILBIT | Posted: 3/12/2003 12:06:59 PM
Hi.

Great that there are still attempts to breath more life into the game.

Have a question. No longer have the game but was watching someone playing the game, begining at chozo ruins.
In that game made a few tries and came reasonably close to the spot were the missile was

Anyone has reached the missile at the plaza before the morph ball?
It wont serve for nothing but skiping the first mini boos would be nice, or at least entering the back way.

Thanks for the time.
From: Amasawa | Posted: 3/12/2003 12:34:10 PM
sup DEVILBIT, that's a shame you don't have MP anymore, but glad to see you're still around.

Which expansion do you mean exactly -- you must mean the one across from the grapple point, correct? I have trouble getting it just with space jump, although that's not saying much.

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Metroid Prime Discoveries
http://membres.lycos.fr/zell99/metroid
From: keybladeswordsman | Posted: 3/12/2003 4:04:42 PM
Too bad also the Dash jump doesn't work for the Varialess Magmoor. You need to lock on something, and that something are enemies. A, you can't see where you are going.B, You will have to land on something at a lower elevation than you are. C, you cannot kill the enemy which will attack you.

Ragnarok, Just keep trying. I did it in about 4 days, 3 when no one did it from the back of the ship before.

And I think DEVILBIT refers to the one under the bridge that you need the boost ball.

And anyone who has reached transport tunnel A, tell me your strategies. I can help too.
From: Snoopdigger XP | Posted: 3/12/2003 4:43:30 PM
Zell99: I'm sorry, but yes, you are out of date. So far montypylon10189 has the current record of getting all the way to the door at the end of Transport Access A. I think I am in second place, about halfway through Transport Access A.
Keybladeswordsman: It's really hard to explain strategies, because there is so much reflex action going on, and you need to make snap-decisions. Sometimes you will vary a strategy you are using in order to get a faster time. BTW, what is your time...
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Top scientist in the Varia-less Magmoor run! 52 seconds!
Y x 1.3 - I - O > 5 x 1.3 - 1 - 2.4 = 3.1 = 5.5
From: Snoopdigger XP | Posted: 3/12/2003 4:52:26 PM
Oh, yeah, I'm going to start a Metroid Prime Sequence Breaking FAQ. (Everyone who contributed a noticeable amount of effort towards any discovery WILL GET CREDIT credit)
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Top scientist in the Varia-less Magmoor run! 52 seconds!
Y x 1.3 - I - O > 5 x 1.3 - 1 - 2.4 = 3.1 = 5.5
From: montypylon10189 | Posted: 3/12/2003 5:34:15 PM
I don't exactly know my time... hang on i'll go time myself.
*times self*
I lived 56.54 sceonds
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"Highly Metal-ized by the Space Gorons, Dragon can breath fire and burninate anything! Fear his 1337 powers!"--dejitaru davis on "Dragon" aka Meta-Ridley
From: montypylon10189 | Posted: 3/12/2003 5:36:16 PM
BTW, i got a little ways into transport tunnel A. Hmmmm... i wonder if i tried long enough if i could get that e-tank... *runs off to go try it*
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"Highly Metal-ized by the Space Gorons, Dragon can breath fire and burninate anything! Fear his 1337 powers!"--dejitaru davis on "Dragon" aka Meta-Ridley
From: Snoopdigger XP | Posted: 3/12/2003 8:19:20 PM
This
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Top scientist in the Varia-less Magmoor run! 52 seconds!
Y x 1.3 - I - O > 5 x 1.3 - 1 - 2.4 = 3.1 = 5.5
From: Snoopdigger XP | Posted: 3/12/2003 8:19:45 PM
must
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Top scientist in the Varia-less Magmoor run! 52 seconds!
Y x 1.3 - I - O > 5 x 1.3 - 1 - 2.4 = 3.1 = 5.5
From: Snoopdigger XP | Posted: 3/12/2003 8:21:59 PM
make
From: Snoopdigger XP | Posted: 3/12/2003 8:22:19 PM
it
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Top scientist in the Varia-less Magmoor run! 52 seconds!
Y x 1.3 - I - O > 5 x 1.3 - 1 - 2.4 = 3.1 = 5.5
From: The Gamecube Freak | Posted: 3/12/2003 8:24:12 PM
Can someone tell Me the quickest sequence-breaking way throught the game while still maintaining a 24% percent?
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<('_'<)I am <('_')>Gamecube Freak!(>'_')>
From: Snoopdigger XP | Posted: 3/12/2003 8:27:23 PM
to
From: Snoopdigger XP | Posted: 3/12/2003 8:28:15 PM
500!
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Top scientist in the Varia-less Magmoor run! 52 seconds!
Y x 1.3 - I - O > 5 x 1.3 - 1 - 2.4 = 3.1 = 5.5
From: montypylon10189 | Posted: 3/12/2003 8:44:21 PM
Missiles
Morph Ball
Bombs
Varia Suit
Space Jump
Artifact of Strength
Wave Beam
Boost Ball
Ice Beam
Plasma Beam
Artifact of Spirit
Spider Ball
Artifact of Sun
Artifact of Elder
Power Bombs
Artifact of Warrior
Artifact of Nature
X-Ray Visor
Artifact of Chozo
Phazon Suit/Beam
Artifact of Newborn
Artifact of Wild
Artifact of Lifegiver
Artifact of World
Artifact of Truth

If there's anything i missed, just let me know.
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"Highly Metal-ized by the Space Gorons, Dragon can breath fire and burninate anything! Fear his 1337 powers!"--dejitaru davis on "Dragon" aka Meta-Ridley
From: devan123 | Posted: 3/12/2003 8:44:21 PM
Ok. I know i've never been a part of this topic, but I have been listening to this topic. I have looked at zell 99's site, and I have managed to do a 24% Hard mode game!!!! With a time of 3:35 Min!!! I know this is hard to believe, but it is true. Yes, it is TRUE.
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"Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former." - A. Einstein
From: devan123 | Posted: 3/12/2003 8:45:37 PM
YAY!!! Same Second Post!!! w00t!
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"Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former." - A. Einstein
From: DEVILBIT | Posted: 3/12/2003 8:48:13 PM
Good night.

Was talking about the expansion at the main plaza half pipe. Maybe theres a way to take that one as the first missile in the game so you can skip the boss (the one that gives the missile first time).

Also it is known that the half pipe expansion can be reached just by double jumping to it.

For the record, every item in the MAIN PLAZA can be reached by double jumping (both missiles and the tank).

Good luck with all the experiments and thanks for the time.
From: devan123 | Posted: 3/12/2003 8:49:21 PM
yes, montypylon I used the same order.
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"Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former." - A. Einstein
From: devan123 | Posted: 3/12/2003 8:49:42 PM
Montypylon can u come on AiM?
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"Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former." - A. Einstein
From: Samus aran x | Posted: 3/12/2003 9:00:59 PM
come one this topic MUST LIVE TO 500 SO YOU CAN JUST MAKE ANOTHER ONE

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lowest percentage metroid prime game 24%
1st person to complete it, - #1 metroid player amasawa! :D
From: Samus aran x | Posted: 3/12/2003 9:02:06 PM
THIS(caps)
From: Samus aran x | Posted: 3/12/2003 9:02:34 PM
TOPic
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lowest percentage metroid prime game 24%
1st person to complete it, - #1 metroid player amasawa! :D
From: Samus aran x | Posted: 3/12/2003 9:05:00 PM
MUST LIVE ON!!!!! someone must give new idea's to help....out topic so it doesn't die.....
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lowest percentage metroid prime game 24%
1st person to complete it, - #1 metroid player amasawa! :D
From: Samus aran x | Posted: 3/12/2003 9:11:43 PM
maybe someone should make the next thred to this topic but it should have the cool name of "metroid prime sequence beaking"...... not "ice + grav before thardus"....it souds kindof plain..... banks.....amasawa.....kip.....funkytoad....? do you all think this is a good idea? or not (and no im not saying I want to make the next thred because that's kinda dumb if you don't even know me......by the way i did a run thru magmoor and i got halfway thru transport tunnel a then died....... man that scream is......just.......scary....!
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lowest percentage metroid prime game 24%
1st person to complete it, - #1 metroid player amasawa! :D
From: Nick92 | Posted: 3/12/2003 9:12:30 PM
I think I might start trying this weekend.
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Feel free to flame me if this message is n00bish, idiotic, annoying, stupid, etc. Feel free to think I'm paranoid if this sig makes me seem paranoid.
From: Snoopdigger XP | Posted: 3/12/2003 9:12:45 PM
COME ON!!! WE ARE ALMOST THROUGH MAGMOOR CAVERNS!!! WE HAVE TO MAKE IT!!!
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Top scientist in the Varia-less Magmoor run! 52 seconds!
Y x 1.3 - I - O > 5 x 1.3 - 1 - 2.4 = 3.1 = 5.5
From: Samus aran x | Posted: 3/12/2003 9:29:39 PM
I HAD 5 HEALTH.....I WAS WALKING THRU THE DOOR......THEN I DIED!!!!!
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lowest percentage metroid prime game 24%
1st person to complete it, - #1 metroid player amasawa! :D
From: myermian | Posted: 3/12/2003 11:24:38 PM
Man, as far as the magmoor run goes, how the @#$%^ do you guys get so far!? I can't even get past the 3rd room without dying!
From: Samus aran x | Posted: 3/13/2003 5:24:50 AM
i killed the magmoors((well i at least stunned them so they didn't breath fire on me)) and every enemy that i seen while going super frikin fast.....and i didn't use missles cause all i got from the boxes were missles then..... but then....bye bye to me i died cause i probobly went WAYYYYYY to slow in the 2nd room. (i got a good frigate escape time well not as good a some people but it's good for a girl) :D.......but.......that.......scream.......that.....she..does...
when....she...dies...i....don't .......like....it....at....all.... ((when your playing it in the dark....agh!!!))
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lowest percentage metroid prime game 24%
1st person to complete it, - #1 metroid player amasawa! :D
From: Starscreams Revenge | Posted: 3/13/2003 5:28:10 AM
That was a long run on sentence and I am impressed by how much you said without using a single period even though there are several places where you use a lot of periods but they're not for seperating sentences since you use conjunctions after the period over and over which means it's all one big sentence and it sure was a long run-on.
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"I fondly remember collecting Pokemon for hours on end"
... or was it, "I collectively remember fondling them"?
From: Samus aran x | Posted: 3/13/2003 5:36:34 AM
*sarcasticly* WELL SOOOOOOOOOOOORRRRRRRRRRRYYYYYYYYY i don't have an english teacher behind me telling me every single thing i did wrong... *end sarcasim* so :P
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lowest percentage metroid prime game 24%
From: myermian | Posted: 3/13/2003 10:53:32 AM
Which path do you guys take, is it possible to go the other way? I forgot if there was a 'powerbomb' blockage area going towards the monitor station... Going in from the 'normal' entrance (the one with a save point by it, I can't even get passed the second area of lavalake! I have NO CLUE how you guys are getting even to the monitor station!
From: Jial Silverthorn | Posted: 3/13/2003 11:37:42 AM
What the hell is up with Zell's site?
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Life is but a dream...
The sad thing is, we all have to wake up sometime...
From: kip | Posted: 3/13/2003 12:45:08 PM
don't use that path you're using, the rooms are hotter (she takes more damage per second from the heat), and the number of rooms on that path as opposed to the other are either the same, or there are actually more rooms. they also tend to take longer to get through (lava lake is the perfect example).

instead, go to tallon overworld and save at the ship, then take the root cave's elevator to magmoor (the door halfway up "tallon canyon" leads to root cave, take the bottom door there and you'll come to the elevator).

at this rate with nobody managing to get through magmoor using the root cave path (which is easier than the other), it's pretty pointless to spend any time trying to get through via the chozo ruins path; you seem to have been unknowingly doing that, so please do yourself a favor and check out the root cave path instead. =P
From: Nick92 | Posted: 3/13/2003 3:13:32 PM
Bump
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Feel free to flame me if this message is n00bish, idiotic, annoying, stupid, etc. Feel free to think I'm paranoid if this sig makes me seem paranoid.
From: darkfox01 | Posted: 3/13/2003 4:39:07 PM
If only I had the time, skill, and pastience, I would help, but sadly, this is all I can do. Bump. I retrospect, this is the worst thing I've done because I've taken valuable posting space. >_< >_< X_X
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"Knowledge equals power. Power corrupts. Study hard, be evil." "It's amazing how every time you open your mouth you prove you're an idiot" Vegeta-DBZ
From: Snoopdigger XP | Posted: 3/13/2003 5:41:35 PM
Kip, I tested out both places and found that you lose health at the same rate.

100 units per Energy Tank
3 Energy Tanks
99 Units to start

(100 x 3) + 99 = 399

You lose all your health, in both areas, in 39.48 seconds (using a stopwatch).
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399|39.48 = 0.989474

That means you you have approx. 40 seconds, assuming you don't hit any enemies or pick power-ups.

CONCLUSION: We can determine that you lose health equally in both places, so you should take the Root Cave path; it's faster.
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Top scientist in the Varia-less Magmoor run! 52 seconds!
Y x 1.3 - I - O > 5 x 1.3 - 1 - 2.4 = 3.1 = 5.5
From: keybladeswordsman | Posted: 3/13/2003 6:11:18 PM
I can survive approximately 54.28 seconds.

Lets see. I must keep trying so that I can make it.
From: Theotherwhitemeat | Posted: 3/13/2003 6:48:18 PM
[This message was deleted by a GameFAQs Moderator]
From: Amasawa | Posted: 3/13/2003 7:08:26 PM
you might not want to bother with it any more then, if you're having a lot of trouble with that part of the trick. the rest of it gets harder.
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Metroid Prime Discoveries
http://membres.lycos.fr/zell99/metroid
From: Theotherwhitemeat | Posted: 3/13/2003 7:15:40 PM
ugh, are you serious?

i get soo close, like her face is rubbing it, but she wont step on it, lol. i just dont see how you can make that jump!

and another thing i tried was the space jump early with the double bomb off of the ship. I cant get either of these to work, i must suck. The videos kinda help but i wish they were better quality or something. I dont really care about SJ cuz i already have it, but plasma i want and its so hard!
From: Amasawa | Posted: 3/13/2003 7:19:39 PM
the space jump off the ship is one of the hardest tricks to pull off, if you ask me.

but getting to the platform from that spire is relatively easy compared to the other tricks imo. Have you read the part about L Lock Spring Jumping? That helps a LOT if you you the L trigger to sort of "lookspring" during the jump; you'd be amazed how much distance it adds.
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Metroid Prime Discoveries
http://membres.lycos.fr/zell99/metroid
From: Theotherwhitemeat | Posted: 3/13/2003 7:44:06 PM
i did what the video did but i cant seem to make it. Plus, when i try to keep the view down, it automatically looks forward when i do the SJ
From: Amasawa | Posted: 3/13/2003 7:54:38 PM
well, the idea with the looking down first is that you look down, jump forward toward the platform while still holding the L trigger (and still looking down), then release the L trigger midway through your first jump so that the view will spring up, back to center, as you're still moving forward, then you just jump again (in midair) as usual. you can vary that technique by releasing L later, but that's how I usually do it.

does that help at all, or does this just sound confusing as hell? (not flaming, I just don't think I'm doing the greatest job of explaining this, is all <:])
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Metroid Prime Discoveries
http://membres.lycos.fr/zell99/metroid
From: Theotherwhitemeat | Posted: 3/13/2003 7:58:55 PM
i know what you mean, unfortunately i cant test it out cuz i have to shower, sleep, then school. thx though, ill try later.
From: Amasawa | Posted: 3/13/2003 8:03:34 PM
np. good luck whenever you get around to trying it again.
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Metroid Prime Discoveries
http://membres.lycos.fr/zell99/metroid
From: Ragnarok72 | Posted: 3/13/2003 8:46:13 PM
I'd just like to take this time to say that I finally accomplished getting the Plasma Beam Early without the spiderball, (I usually get the spiderball first before getting plasma early, so this is new for me) so Yay for me!! :P

And, I'm still working on that Space Jump Early thing. I found that doing the trick has one VERY big side effect: Frustration.

Aside from that, I may not have much time to work on it, as I have this big college project I have to focus my time on, as well as this new job I'm starting.....
From: Teckguy2 | Posted: 3/13/2003 9:46:13 PM
How do you get plasma w/out spiderball
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Thardus would be a nice addition to the Rolling Stones...
From: Videogaming | Posted: 3/13/2003 10:12:43 PM
By visiting zell's site.

Speaking of zell's site, he better update quick. Either that, or someone save this topic to disk so he can get all the new stuff on his site.

Post 488, I believe...only 12 to go...
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Opinions are like buttholes. Everyone has one.
From: JackieChun | Posted: 3/13/2003 10:13:29 PM
*KARMAPOST*
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<<>AJ<>> o{xxx]:^:^:^:^:^>I think that the head is the least important part of the body. It always gets in the way.
From: zell99 | Posted: 3/13/2003 10:55:43 PM
Videogaming- I could update, but I don't follow MP that much anymore.. the only new thing that I know of is the "dash jump"
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http://membres.lycos.fr/zell99/metroid
Y'all [...] make sure it's popin' when we get up there... -Tupac
From: NeoMechaSonic | Posted: 3/14/2003 12:36:03 AM
Can someone tell me how to get to the area with the plasma beam after beating thardus? Thanks a lot!
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"Ah Porn, that universal gift!" ~Arinath
From: Samus aran x | Posted: 3/14/2003 6:19:46 AM
it's in magmoor caverns you go past the part where u usually go to phendrana and follow a tunnel thing then a few rooms later u spiderball along a track and then a couple other tunnels knocking some stalactites down and then if you don't have the grappling beam then your sequence breaking so you would have to jump on a rock.. then over to a peice of metal sticking out of the wall then a small spire of rock... freoom there u judst jump onto the huge things you spin and go normally from there :D more info on this site if you didn't understand a word i said ***WARNING THIS SITE CONTAINS SPOILERS**
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http://membres.lycos.fr/zell99/metroid/index.html
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that's zells metroid sequence breaking site....
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im a girl....just to let you know...
From: Theotherwhitemeat | Posted: 3/14/2003 6:22:07 AM
Hey, I was so into getting it early that i tried last night before i went to bed. After my first try i made it past the jump i had trouble with. I dont know how i thought it was hard. I fell off a few times and i tried the L-lock spring jump for the first jump, and it helped a lot, too. Unfortunately, i'm an idiot and didnt have the ice beam so i couldnt get plasma. But, i'd already beaten Thardus, too, so its not too long till i actually get it. Saturday im just gonna play this game all day, and when i finish my game on hard mode with 100% items and scans, then i'll make a new one and try to get everything early that i can.

Thanks again for your help.
From: montypylon10189 | Posted: 3/14/2003 6:22:53 AM
Yeah, this topic need to get to 500. Who's gonna make the next one, though?
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"Highly Metal-ized by the Space Gorons, Dragon can breath fire and burninate anything! Fear his 1337 powers!"--dejitaru davis on "Dragon" aka Meta-Ridley
From: Amasawa | Posted: 3/14/2003 6:26:56 AM
Be careful, theotherwhitemeat -- sounds like you might be getting addicted! ^_^

that's cool, I'm glad it worked out. yeah, you should have no problem getting it now, so have w/the game tomorrow.
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Metroid Prime Discoveries
http://membres.lycos.fr/zell99/metroid
From: Amasawa | Posted: 3/14/2003 6:27:43 AM
er, have FUN with the game tomorrow, even
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Metroid Prime Discoveries
http://membres.lycos.fr/zell99/metroid
From: Theotherwhitemeat | Posted: 3/14/2003 6:32:59 AM
lol, yah thanks. I guess i sorta am addicted.. O well, same thing happened with Metroid 3. And 4.
From: Amasawa | Posted: 3/14/2003 6:41:49 AM
tell me about it. it took me forever to get into 4 cuz I kept finding other things to do, was too busy, etc., but when that bug bit, I couldn't put the game down! I was like "just this oooooone last thing, I know I can find it, and then I'll turn this off". 5 "things" later, the GBA was still on and I was late for my doctor's appt. <=]
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Metroid Prime Discoveries
http://membres.lycos.fr/zell99/metroid
From: Amasawa | Posted: 3/14/2003 6:44:05 AM
Yeah, this topic need to get to 500. Who's gonna make the next one, though?

Guess I can take care of it, since I'm busy littering this thread with my rambling on...
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Metroid Prime Discoveries
http://membres.lycos.fr/zell99/metroid
From: Amasawa | Posted: 3/14/2003 6:44:49 AM
*ahem

This topic is now closed. Please refer to the latest sequence breaking thread (6.0).
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Metroid Prime Discoveries
http://membres.lycos.fr/zell99/metroid