MP2:E pales compared to MP *contains spoilers*

2005-01-28 04:01:12 pm

Now before I go further, may I just say that there is NO DOUBT in my mind that MP2:E is an amazing game. However, in being a direct sequel to the original MP, I feel let down. This is why:

1) Music. While the music was atmospheric enough, and set the mood, it did not instill any sense of 'wow', or have any really absorping aspects. Yes, I know that some of the tunes are remixes of games gone by, that doesn't itself justify them being hailed as 'great'. The music in the original Prime however, I found engrossing. From the warrior-like chants in Magmoor, to the two different mixes of a truly magical, wonderous melody in Phendrana, all the way through to the two truly brilliant Tallon overworld themes (a shame you can't get the original tune back after a point :(). The Chozo Ruins and and Phazon mines were good but not amazing, and so just complemented the rest.

2) Story. Now this is where it really fell on its face. Being a direct sequel, I would expect some direct story.

-Dark Samus is the hand from MP at the end of that game, and so she ends up on Aether. Did she come from the comet that hit?
-Did the comet that hit contain phazon? I presume so, though there's no mention of it.
- How did Dark Aether come to exist? The phazon that was probably on the comet is somehow linked to the dark matter, but how? None of this is explained. Why was there no dark matter on Tallon?

-Although she just whipped off the planet and took her helmet off and she contemplated the destruction of the Tallon homeworld at the end of MP, that's all that was needed because there was no-one to interact with. MP2:E had the Luminoth though, and she just bogged off, waving her hand, took her suit off and went.

Why did they even call it MP2? MP had nothing to do with it; the only link was Dark Samus. Metroids didn't even have any proper role to play in it.

3) Size. OK you say, there are two worlds. No. It's not like Zelda: ALttP on the SNES... The Dark Aether is not fully expansive like the original Aether. Sections that are blocked off by impenatrable Ingworms are just thrown in when appropriate to transport to from Aether, and the designers just had to take a designed area, change it a bit and then use that as the Dark Aether alternative. There is probably a bit more to explore than MP in total, but I'd happily have exchanged the whole of Dark Aether for another fully explorable area.

4) Enemies. I noticed that quite a few of the inhabitants of Aether were actually just Tallon's inhabitants with different skins. Shortcuts; didn't feel 'new'. Enough said.

5) Weapons. Oh come on... light and dark matter weapons, not a bad idea. But JUST light and dark weapons? The fourth weapon to acquire was just a combination of the two. I think that given the light/dark nature of the game, a couple of extra beams on top of those would've been a good idea. And don't say "But you can only get 4 weapons on the stick". There are a dozen ways around it; it doesn't have to be that restrictive. And you could have just upgraded one or two of the beams.

Second point, I think that there could have been more improvements since MP. All that we have are some different beams and visors, which are the same principle, the screw attack and the under-water boost. Look at how many extras theer are in Banjo-Tooie compared to Banjo-Kazooie on the N64.

So, there you go. Like I say, it's a great game, but not that much of a great sequel. Your thoughts appreciated. ;)

Thread title:

Now before I go further, may I just say that there is NO DOUBT in my mind that MP2:E is an amazing game.  However, in being a direct sequel to the original MP, I feel let down.  This is why:

1) Music.  While the music was atmospheric enough, and set the mood, it did not instill any sense of 'wow', or have any really absorping aspects. Yes, I know that some of the tunes are remixes of games gone by, that doesn't itself justify them being hailed as 'great'.  The music in the original Prime however, I found engrossing.  From the warrior-like chants in Magmoor, to the two different mixes of a truly magical, wonderous melody in Phendrana, all the way through to the two truly brilliant Tallon overworld themes (a shame you can't get the original tune back after a point :().  The Chozo Ruins and and Phazon mines were good but not amazing, and so just complemented the rest.

2) Story.  Now this is where it really fell on its face.  Being a direct sequel, I would expect some direct story.

-Dark Samus is the hand from MP at the end of that game, and so she ends up on Aether.  Did she come from the comet that hit?  
-Did the comet that hit contain phazon?  I presume so, though there's no mention of it. 
- How did Dark Aether come to exist?  The phazon that was probably on the comet is somehow linked to the dark matter, but how?  None of this is explained.  Why was there no dark matter on Tallon?

-Although she just whipped off the planet and took her helmet off and she contemplated the destruction of the Tallon homeworld at the end of MP, that's all that was needed because there was no-one to interact with.  MP2:E had the Luminoth though, and she just bogged off, waving her hand, took her suit off and went.

Why did they even call it MP2?  MP had nothing to do with it; the only link was Dark Samus.  Metroids didn't even have any proper role to play in it.

3) Size.  OK you say, there are two worlds.  No.  It's not like Zelda: ALttP on the SNES... The Dark Aether is not fully expansive like the original Aether.  Sections that are blocked off by impenatrable Ingworms are just thrown in when appropriate to transport to from Aether, and the designers just had to take a designed area, change it a bit and then use that as the Dark Aether alternative.  There is probably a bit more to explore than MP in total, but I'd happily have exchanged the whole of Dark Aether for another fully explorable area.

4)  Enemies.  I noticed that quite a few of the inhabitants of Aether were actually just Tallon's inhabitants with different skins.  Shortcuts; didn't feel 'new'.  Enough said.

5) Weapons.  Oh come on... light and dark matter weapons, not a bad idea.  But JUST light and dark weapons?  The fourth weapon to acquire was just a combination of the two.  I think that given the light/dark nature of the game, a couple of extra beams on top of those would've been a good idea.  And don't say "But you can only get 4 weapons on the stick".  There are a dozen ways around it; it doesn't have to be that restrictive.  And you could have just upgraded one or two of the beams.

Second point, I think that there could have been more improvements since MP.  All that we have are some different beams and visors, which are the same principle, the screw attack and the under-water boost.  Look at how many extras theer are in Banjo-Tooie compared to Banjo-Kazooie on the N64.

So, there you go.  Like I say, it's a great game, but not that much of a great sequel.  Your thoughts appreciated. ;)

Ekarderif

2005-01-28 04:41:19 pm

1) Agreed. I love Prime's music and Echoes' music can't even compare.

2) Meh. I don't care. Metroid is best without story anyways.

3) Echoes is defintely bigger. I'd say that it's slightly bigger without even the Dark World factored in, and with it it's not even close.

4) Not really. Most enemies felt different enough that I didn't care. The only exception is the Ingsmasher, who looks too much like an Elite Pirate that it's funny. I mean, I can understand the Pirate Commando (no Phazon infusion but somewhat similar concepts developed by the same race) but a totally different race recreating the shock trooper of a different species? Yeah...

5) Somehow, I don't think 12 new items doesn't translate to lack of new stuff. Even Super Metroid didn't offer as much boost in arsenal.

GreenMamba

2005-01-28 04:48:22 pm

What luck, there's french fry stuck in my beard.

Music? Metroid Prime's music sucked with a capital S. Echoes' music is way, way, way better.

AndehX

2005-01-28 05:11:05 pm

Quote from GreenMamba:

Music? Metroid Prime's music sucked with a capital S. Echoes' music is way, way, way better.

1 or 2 of the remixes are good, but thats it. MP1 music was alot better overall. end of story

Yoshi348

2005-01-28 05:15:01 pm

PAGE BREAKER

Ready and willing.

MUSIC FIGHT!!!!!!!!!!!!

Arguing music is second... er, third?... only to arguing politics and religion.

Zeke

2005-01-28 05:30:46 pm

Time bomb set get out fast!

Quote from Yoshi348:

MUSIC FIGHT!!!!!!!!!!!!

Arguing music is second... er, third?... only to arguing politics and religion.

It's all the same. Music and politics are religions. ;)

Random Zelda Person

2005-01-28 05:38:52 pm

Deep, man. Real deep.

Vincent Core

2005-01-28 05:53:30 pm

1) I agree. I always found myself humming MP1's music while playing or getting it stuck in my head when I wasn't; MP2's isn't pretty good, but not as good as it could have been.

2) I agree again. The Light/Dark world concept has been done many times before and MP2E doesn't seem to have done it any different than those before.

3) I agree with and disagree with you on this one. Although MP2 is a bit bigger, it could have been much larger had Retro not thrown Ingworms around everywhere. What I had expected was every room to have a Dark World mirror, and instead the Dark World portals seem like one big puzzle, the only time you go to the Dark World is for puzzles, keys, and bosses.

4) Grenchler = Baby Sheegoth; Ingsmasher = Some Pirate-thing; Pirate Commando = Chozo Ghost;
ENOUGH OF THE FLICKERBATTING CLONES!

5) Completely agree. Before MP2 came out, new beams sounded like a good idea; however, after playing it, I hate having only Light/Dark based beams. Even though there are the some number of beams, I found myself thinking as MP2's four beams as less than MP1's beam. Where there were once a wide variety of weapons (Power, Electricity, Ice, Fire), MP2 has three beams of the same family (Light, Dark, Mix).
Another thing that made the beams boring was that most, if not all, of the enemies had a blaring weakness to one of the beams. Therefore, if you were going to use a beam other than Power, there would be only one choice. To a certain degree, MP1 had this, too, in that each new beam seemed to make the previous one useless, but not as bad, IMO, as is the case in MP2.

1) I agree. I always found myself humming MP1's music while playing or getting it stuck in my head when I wasn't; MP2's isn't pretty good, but not as good as it could have been.

2) I agree again. The Light/Dark world concept has been done many times before and MP2E doesn't seem to have done it any different than those before.

3) I agree with and disagree with you on this one. Although MP2 is a bit bigger, it could have been much larger had Retro not thrown Ingworms around everywhere. What I had expected was every room to have a Dark World mirror, and instead the Dark World portals seem like one big puzzle, the only time you go to the Dark World is for puzzles, keys, and bosses.

4) Grenchler = Baby Sheegoth; Ingsmasher = Some Pirate-thing; Pirate Commando = Chozo Ghost;
ENOUGH OF THE FLICKERBATTING CLONES!

5) Completely agree. Before MP2 came out, new beams sounded like a good idea; however, after playing it, I hate having only Light/Dark based beams. Even though there are the some number of beams, I found myself thinking as MP2's four beams as less than MP1's beam. Where there were once a wide variety of weapons (Power, Electricity, Ice, Fire), MP2 has three beams of the same family (Light, Dark, Mix).
Another thing that made the beams boring was that most, if not all, of the enemies had a blaring weakness to one of the beams. Therefore, if you were going to use a beam other than Power, there would be only one choice. To a certain degree, MP1 had this, too, in that each new beam seemed to make the previous one useless, but not as bad, IMO, as is the case in MP2.

Vincent Core

2005-01-28 06:13:35 pm

Quote from Ekarderif:

Somehow, I don't think 12 new items doesn't translate to lack of new stuff. Even Super Metroid didn't offer as much boost in arsenal.

missile launcher - In Prime
violet translator - Getting rid of walls and enabling Lore scanning doesn't count
morph ball bomb - In Prime
amber translator - See above
space jump boots - In Prime
dark beam - Ice beam + Black crayon
light beam - Plasma Beam + bleach
dark suit - Slows environment damage like Varia did, appearance is new
super missile - In Prime
emerald translator - See above
boost ball - In Prime
seeker launcher - Missile Launcher x5, hardly a new item
gravity boost - Gravity Suit + Third Jump
grapple beam - In Prime
dark visor - Spiffy and less annoying Thermal Visor
cobalt translator - See above
spider ball - In Prime
power bomb - In Prime
echo visor - Spiffy and more annoying X-Ray visor
screw attack - Classic space jump, although new to Prime
annihilator beam - Power Beam's rapid fire + homing aspect + sound
light suit - the other half of Varia's effect, completely stops environment damage; Light riding is the silliest effect I've ever seen

There you have it, maybe five upgrades that are truly new.

[quote="Ekarderif"]Somehow, I don't think 12 new items doesn't translate to lack of new stuff. Even Super Metroid didn't offer as much boost in arsenal.[/quote]missile launcher - In Prime
violet translator - Getting rid of walls and enabling Lore scanning doesn't count
morph ball bomb - In Prime
amber translator - See above
space jump boots - In Prime
dark beam - Ice beam + Black crayon
light beam - Plasma Beam + bleach
dark suit - Slows environment damage like Varia did, appearance is new
super missile - In Prime
emerald translator - See above
boost ball - In Prime
seeker launcher - Missile Launcher x5, hardly a new item
gravity boost - Gravity Suit + Third Jump
grapple beam - In Prime
dark visor - Spiffy and less annoying Thermal Visor
cobalt translator - See above
spider ball - In Prime
power bomb - In Prime
echo visor - Spiffy and more annoying X-Ray visor
screw attack - Classic space jump, although new to Prime
annihilator beam - Power Beam's rapid fire + homing aspect + sound
light suit - the other half of Varia's effect, completely stops environment damage; Light riding is the silliest effect I've ever seen

There you have it, maybe five upgrades that are truly new.

Ekarderif

2005-01-28 06:48:35 pm

Super had Dash Boots, X-Ray, Spazer, Charge, and Power Bombs. Reserve tanks may be counted as a half I guess. So the 5 "truly" new items plus the 7 "fakely" new items plus the 4 "bullshit" items is still more than Super offered. Stop complaining.

Edit: Seeker's not new? Yeah, and I'm the pope. I felt it was the most ingenious item since the Dash Boots. Echo is like X-Ray and Dark is like Thermal? You got to be kidding me...

Laney

(user is banned)

2005-01-28 07:02:05 pm

In my opinion Metroid Echoes was a really good game.
The Music was similar to Prime 1 but some tracks were unbelievable good, for example Pirate Fear.
But what I wanted to say: Stop complaining, folks! Don't compare this game to Prime, Prime was a completely different game!
Both of them had this Metroid feeling, but if you compare Prime with Echoes it would be same like if you compare Prime 1 , or Zero with Super.

Yoshi348

2005-01-28 07:06:20 pm

PAGE BREAKER

Ready and willing.

Quote from Ekarderif:

Echo is like X-Ray and Dark is like Thermal? You got to be kidding me...

Um... besides the pallete swapping effects, the visors are pretty much the same. In fact, the X-Ray is almost the same as Thermal.

Vincent Core

2005-01-28 07:18:51 pm

Quote from Ekarderif:

Super had Dash Boots, X-Ray, Spazer, Charge, and Power Bombs. Reserve tanks may be counted as a half I guess. So the 5 "truly" new items plus the 7 "fakely" new items plus the 4 "gunship" items is still more than Super offered. Stop complaining.

I wasn't referring to Super, I was comparing Prime 1 and Prime 2, and for the record I wasn't complaining, you said there were 12 new items and I told what I thought about those items.

Quote:

Edit: Seeker's not new? Yeah, and I'm the pope. I felt it was the most ingenious item since the Dash Boots. Echo is like X-Ray and Dark is like Thermal? You got to be kidding me...

Seekers are closer to being an upgrade of an old item than being a new item of their own.
Thermal visor sees enemies in the dark, the Dark Visor makes creatures glow red. Thermal Visor sees targets to power with the Wave Beam, Dark Visor sees targets for Seeker Missile. Their uses are close, not what they are. In a game, what matters is what they're used for.

Laney: First, people <i>do</i> compare Prime with the 2D Metroids. Second, we are comparing them because they were both made by Retro and one is a direct sequel to the other.

[quote="Ekarderif"]Super had Dash Boots, X-Ray, Spazer, Charge, and Power Bombs. Reserve tanks may be counted as a half I guess. So the 5 "truly" new items plus the 7 "fakely" new items plus the 4 "gunship" items is still more than Super offered. Stop complaining.[/quote]I wasn't referring to Super, I was comparing Prime 1 and Prime 2, and for the record I wasn't complaining, you said there were 12 new items and I told what I thought about those items.
[quote]Edit: Seeker's not new? Yeah, and I'm the pope. I felt it was the most ingenious item since the Dash Boots. Echo is like X-Ray and Dark is like Thermal? You got to be kidding me...[/quote]Seekers are closer to being an upgrade of an old item than being a new item of their own.
Thermal visor sees enemies in the dark, the Dark Visor makes creatures glow red. Thermal Visor sees targets to power with the Wave Beam, Dark Visor sees targets for Seeker Missile. Their uses are close, not what they are. In a game, what matters is what they're used for.

Laney: First, people <i>do</i> compare Prime with the 2D Metroids. Second, we are comparing them because they were both made by Retro and one is a direct sequel to the other.

groovemeister

2005-01-28 09:03:55 pm

Quote from Vincent Core:

Quote from Ekarderif:

Somehow, I don't think 12 new items doesn't translate to lack of new stuff. Even Super Metroid didn't offer as much boost in arsenal.

missile launcher - In Prime
violet translator - Getting rid of walls and enabling Lore scanning doesn't count
morph ball bomb - In Prime
amber translator - See above
space jump boots - In Prime
dark beam - Ice beam + Black crayon
light beam - Plasma Beam + bleach
dark suit - Slows environment damage like Varia did, appearance is new
super missile - In Prime
emerald translator - See above
boost ball - In Prime
seeker launcher - Missile Launcher x5, hardly a new item
gravity boost - Gravity Suit + Third Jump
grapple beam - In Prime
dark visor - Spiffy and less annoying Thermal Visor
cobalt translator - See above
spider ball - In Prime
power bomb - In Prime
echo visor - Spiffy and more annoying X-Ray visor
screw attack - Classic space jump, although new to Prime
annihilator beam - Power Beam's rapid fire + homing aspect + sound
light suit - the other half of Varia's effect, completely stops environment damage; Light riding is the silliest effect I've ever seen

There you have it, maybe five upgrades that are truly new.

Thank you! Well, the translators I wouldn't have counted anyway.
New, different suits I think are just part of the game, as they didn't introduce any new concepts. What actually counts are the movement systems which - yes - were new, and the visors, of which only the sound visor was original. The dark visor was basically Xray. It operates differently but same concept (see that not viewable in the normal spectrum).

Yes, the 5x rocklet launcher was a good addition, but I wouldn't have called it an all together 'new weapon'.

I think that a really good idea would have been if they had JUST a sound gun. A blast of transparent 'morphing' moving air (the way it does around the charge beam, but without the charge beam if you get my meaning). In all, a beam that moved like the annihilator beam but was stripped of the light/dark nature - say, the magnetic bolt (hence the locking-on nature of it) would have been good, too. Throw in an alternating light/dark beam or a dual, upgradable light/dark energy bolt for the sake of diversity. There - that wasn't hard. Why couldn't Retro have done that?

Different enemies could have had different and varying susceptibilities to these, much like in MP, though more diverse because of the larger amount of combinations.

Quote from Laney:

In my opinion Metroid Echoes was a really good game.
The Music was similar to Prime 1 but some tracks were unbelievable good, for example Pirate Fear.
But what I wanted to say: Stop complaining, folks! Don't compare this game to Prime, Prime was a completely different game!
Both of them had this Metroid feeling, but if you compare Prime with Echoes it would be same like if you compare Prime 1 , or Zero with Super.

Prime was not a completely different game, hence MP2's name. I haven't heard of a Super Metroid 2 or a Metroid Fusion 2. MP2 is MP2 because it is a direct sequel. And they're not completely different; one's wearing a different skin. And, like I said: I'm not dissapointed in it as a game in itself, I'm disappointed in it as a sequel.

I wouldn't say it had a 'Metroid feeling', though... I hardly ever saw any metroids in MP2!

[quote="Vincent Core"][quote="Ekarderif"]Somehow, I don't think 12 new items doesn't translate to lack of new stuff. Even Super Metroid didn't offer as much boost in arsenal.[/quote]missile launcher - In Prime
violet translator - Getting rid of walls and enabling Lore scanning doesn't count
morph ball bomb - In Prime
amber translator - See above
space jump boots - In Prime
dark beam - Ice beam + Black crayon
light beam - Plasma Beam + bleach
dark suit - Slows environment damage like Varia did, appearance is new
super missile - In Prime
emerald translator - See above
boost ball - In Prime
seeker launcher - Missile Launcher x5, hardly a new item
gravity boost - Gravity Suit + Third Jump
grapple beam - In Prime
dark visor - Spiffy and less annoying Thermal Visor
cobalt translator - See above
spider ball - In Prime
power bomb - In Prime
echo visor - Spiffy and more annoying X-Ray visor
screw attack - Classic space jump, although new to Prime
annihilator beam - Power Beam's rapid fire + homing aspect + sound
light suit - the other half of Varia's effect, completely stops environment damage; Light riding is the silliest effect I've ever seen

There you have it, maybe five upgrades that are truly new.[/quote]

Thank you!  Well, the translators I wouldn't have counted anyway.  
New, different suits I think are just part of the game, as they didn't introduce any new concepts.  What actually counts are the movement systems which - yes - were new, and the visors, of which only the sound visor was original.  The dark visor was basically Xray.  It operates differently but same concept (see that not viewable in the normal spectrum).

Yes, the 5x rocklet launcher was a good addition, but I wouldn't have called it an all together 'new weapon'.

I think that a really good idea would have been if they had JUST a sound gun.  A blast of transparent 'morphing' moving air (the way it does around the charge beam, but without the charge beam if you get my meaning).  In all, a beam that moved like the annihilator beam but was stripped of the light/dark nature - say, the magnetic bolt (hence the locking-on nature of it) would have been good, too.  Throw in an alternating light/dark beam or a dual, upgradable light/dark energy bolt for the sake of diversity.  There - that wasn't hard.  Why couldn't Retro have done that?

Different enemies could have had different and varying susceptibilities to these, much like in MP, though more diverse because of the larger amount of combinations.

[quote="Laney"]In my opinion Metroid Echoes was a really good game. 
The Music was similar to Prime 1 but some tracks were unbelievable good, for example Pirate Fear. 
But what I wanted to say: Stop complaining, folks! Don't compare this game to Prime, Prime was a completely different game!
Both of them had this Metroid feeling, but if you compare Prime  with  Echoes it would be same like if you compare Prime 1 , or Zero with Super.[/quote]

Prime was not a completely different game, hence MP2's name.  I haven't heard of a Super Metroid 2 or a Metroid Fusion 2.  MP2 is MP2 because it is a direct sequel.  And they're not completely different; one's wearing a different skin.  And, like I said: I'm not dissapointed in it as a game in itself, I'm disappointed in it as a sequel.

I wouldn't say it had a 'Metroid feeling', though... I hardly ever saw any metroids in MP2!

arkarian

2005-01-28 09:55:49 pm

red chamber dream

I agree with everything you said, groovemeister, one-hundred percent. Mainly the music. Prime I's music owned Echoes's music in every way, from the title screen to the final battle. Except, possibly, Hydrodynamo Station.

nate

2005-01-28 10:54:23 pm

just because i really feel like inflating my post count, i'm going to come down on the side of neither of them, saying that personally, i love the music from both of them.

beyond that prime 2 really stinks though.

RT-55J

2005-01-28 11:04:10 pm

Armor Guardian

I agree with you people. The box art of MP2:E is pale in comparison to MP1's box art.

Zeke

2005-01-29 12:53:20 am

Time bomb set get out fast!

The Prime 2 title theme is my favourite piece of music from either game. I love how it took the Prime theme and inverted it, turning the sub-melody into the main tune. Beyond that, I haven't played the game enough to compare its music to Prime's.

Prime, for its part, had some truly great tunes -- my favourite is the Hive Mecha battle theme. But it loses points with me for its massive overuse of the Lower Norfair theme from Super Metroid.

tomatobob

2005-01-29 02:00:02 am

One shall stand, one shall ball.

I was only in Magmoor, where's the overuse part?

Random Zelda Person

2005-01-29 03:03:40 am

Quote from tomatobob:

I was only in Magmoor, where's the overuse part?

Tomatobob, your typos never cease to amaze me.

Unless, of course, that was not a typo...

Zeke

2005-01-29 03:27:53 am

Time bomb set get out fast!

Quote from tomatobob:

I was only in Magmoor, where's the overuse part?

Exactly. In the entire huge area of Magmoor, which you have to pass through many times. That music was so effective in Super, creating a creepy, foreboding mood on your way to the most fearsome boss in the game. Magmoor -- an in-between territory which doesn't even contain any bosses -- just wastes it.

Prime Hunter

2005-01-29 07:11:26 am

Why should it matter which one is better overall? Isn't it a good thing that we even GOT another Prime game? I like them both, for different reasons. That's all I care about...

However, I'm still curious as to what Hunters will be like, since I haven't really played the demo: I couldn't figure out how to shoot anything when I had a few minutes with it a while ago at Best Buy Embarassed

groovemeister

2005-01-29 07:39:53 am

Quote from RT-55J:

I agree with you people. The box art of MP2:E is pale in comparison to MP1's box art.

Think yourself lucky. MP2 wasn't holographic over here in Europe. I swear Nintendo hates us, don't even get me started about release dates, prices and past sloppy conversions.

Nida

2005-01-29 11:58:31 am

Prime 2 didn't even feel properly like a Metroid game to me. It feels like everyone is there by a titanic clash of accidents: the Feds just happened to pick a bad spot to explore, the Space Pirates were there for... well, for... maybe they were building a diner or something? As noted before, with no explanation for Phazon's introduction to Aether, there's also no explanation for the Pirates being there. Did they bring the stuff themselves? Were they tracking a Phazon-riddled comet? Do they have a beef with the Luminoth? Did Aether just scream "Build Diner Here"?

Then you've got the Luminoth. WTF. At least with the Chozo connections - however vague in some cases - in the other games in the series, Samus has a reason to go through all this BS. Here on Aether, she's only here to find the Feds (accomplished in the first three seconds of the game Rolling Eyes

), get her stuff back (there's plenty of Chozo depots elsewhere - and it's not like she wants to prevent the tech from falling in the wrong hands; the Pirates have been reverse-engineering Chozo material for a long time), and, apparently, be appointed U-Mos's EPA director and save the planet for no reason whatsoever. This chick is destined to commit two genocides and annihilate two planets in her immediate future, but hey, for now she's all about returning energy from Dark Aether and pushing through tax breaks for Luminoth who choose to buy hybrid-electric gunships.

"The Metroids!" you cry. "She's here to get rid of them!" To which I reply: They shouldn't even have bothered to include the little jellybeans in the first place. The Metroids are quite non-sequiter - it feels like all that pirate data talking about using them for energy was placed to excuse the random appearances of egg cases that look like wasp hives. What were the designers on when they thought of that little gem? Cyanide?

The only excuse I can see for Samus sticking around so long is that she'd naturally have a hate on for her goth twin, and that could have been wrassled out in a totally different game that wouldn't have sucked like a nursing anteater.

And for those of you who don't dig story in the Metroid series, I posit that MP2 was a grueling rote affair that had little of the joy of exploration and discovery of the previous entries in the series. Hell, I had more fun playing the unbreakable Fusion than this drek. Playing the game feels like slogging through a swamp, and that's before you even get to Torvus. Every once in a while, the game throws you a bone - an honestly good puzzle, a cleverly-hidden energy tank - but the long stretches between sapped my soul.

BTW - so just because the Luminoth and the Chozo are both really superadvanced pseudospiritual races, their technology is automatically compatible, so much so that Luminoth tech can be modded on the fly to integrate into a Chozo battlesuit built for a human-turned-half-Chozo girl?

Prime 2 didn't even feel properly like a [i]Metroid[/i] game to me. It feels like everyone is there by a titanic clash of accidents: the Feds just happened to pick a bad spot to explore, the Space Pirates were there for... well, for... maybe they were building a diner or something? As noted before, with no explanation for Phazon's introduction to Aether, there's also no explanation for the Pirates being there. Did they bring the stuff themselves? Were they tracking a Phazon-riddled comet? Do they have a beef with the Luminoth? Did Aether just scream "Build Diner Here"?

Then you've got the Luminoth. WTF. At least with the Chozo connections - however vague in some cases - in the other games in the series, Samus has a reason to go through all this BS. Here on Aether, she's only here to find the Feds (accomplished in the first three seconds of the game :roll: ), get her stuff back (there's plenty of Chozo depots elsewhere - and it's not like she wants to prevent the tech from falling in the wrong hands; the Pirates have been reverse-engineering Chozo material for a long time), and, apparently, be appointed U-Mos's EPA director and save the planet for no reason whatsoever. This chick is destined to commit two genocides and annihilate two planets in her immediate future, but hey, for now she's all about returning energy from Dark Aether and pushing through tax breaks for Luminoth who choose to buy hybrid-electric gunships.

"The Metroids!" you cry. "She's here to get rid of them!" To which I reply: They shouldn't even have bothered to include the little jellybeans in the first place. The Metroids are quite non-sequiter - it feels like all that pirate data talking about using them for energy was placed to excuse the random appearances of [i]egg cases[/i] that look like [i]wasp hives[/i]. What were the designers on when they thought of that little gem? Cyanide?

The only excuse I can see for Samus sticking around so long is that she'd naturally have a hate on for her goth twin, and that could have been wrassled out in a totally different game that wouldn't have sucked like a nursing anteater.

And for those of you who don't dig story in the Metroid series, I posit that MP2 was a grueling rote affair that had little of the joy of exploration and discovery of the previous entries in the series. Hell, I had more fun playing the unbreakable Fusion than this drek. Playing the game feels like slogging through a swamp, and that's before you even get to Torvus. Every once in a while, the game throws you a bone - an honestly good puzzle, a cleverly-hidden energy tank - but the long stretches between sapped my soul.

BTW - so just because the Luminoth and the Chozo are both really superadvanced pseudospiritual races, their technology is automatically compatible, so much so that Luminoth tech can be modded on the fly to integrate into a Chozo battlesuit built for a human-turned-half-Chozo girl?

arkarian

2005-01-29 12:38:10 pm

red chamber dream

You make some great points, Nida. I agree with you...pretty much, Echoes's storyline just plain sucks.